Hi Nil,

I only learned about Telegram itself by seeing discussions about this gateway. I myself am more familiar with a program called GroupMe, which I only learned of because it was used by players in mmorpg games I used to play.

According to the following site, Telegram usage by monthly active users is pretty low: https://www.statista.com/statistics/350461/mobile-messenger-app-usage-usa/


--- tg2fido.pl
* Origin: Telegram to fido gate by Stas Mishchenkov (2:460/58)

Hi Nil,

I only learned about Telegram itself by seeing discussions about this gateway. I myself am more familiar with a program called GroupMe, which I only learned of because it was used by players in mmorpg games I used to play.

Oh.. and I forgot to ask, is Telegram the only one among the other messenger apps that is open-source?


--- tg2fido.pl
* Origin: Telegram to fido gate by Stas Mishchenkov (2:460/58)

Oh.. and I forgot to ask, is Telegram the only one among the other messenger apps that is open-source?

That is possible.


--- tg2fido.pl
* Origin: Telegram to fido gate by Stas Mishchenkov (2:460/58)

Hello, August!

Sunday September 13 2020 04:42, from August Abolins -> Charles Pierson:

Oh.. and I forgot to ask, is Telegram the only one among the other messenger apps that is open-source?

It's actually a bit tricky. Telegram demonstrates transparency and provides the source code, though nobody knows for sure whether the app in the store is built from the sources without any patches.

A bit of a history. Russian government asked Telegram to share the cryptographic keys. Telegram rejected to cooperate and stated that end-to-end cryptography does not have such centralized keys to decrypt the whole traffic. There was a court order to block Telegram in Russia and all ISPs added some traffic filters. All those IP filters caused a lot of troubles to non-Telegram services hosted on AWS and other platforms. It was a long war and Telegram traffic was always able to sneak behind all those filters. Pavel Durov, founder and CEO of Telegram emigrated from Russia.

This year something happened and Durov started writing kinda stupid articles, bitching about miserable live in the US including healthcare, police, education system and taxation. Recently he was talking shit about Apple and Google 30% app store commission and how cruel they are. Anyway, suddenly Russian government has removed the ban and Telegram was unblocked in Russia. It was sort of weird way of resolving the issue, because the legal case against Telegram was not dropped, but it was government direct order to unblock. It definitely shows Durov cooperation.

Best Regards, Nil
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
* Origin: -=NIL BBS=- (2:5015/46)

Hello Nil!

** On Sunday 13.09.20 - 05:14, Nil Alexandrov wrote to August Abolins:

Oh.. and I forgot to ask, is Telegram the only one among
the other messenger apps that is open-source?

It's actually a bit tricky. Telegram demonstrates
transparency and provides the source code, though nobody
knows for sure whether the app in the store is built from
the sources without any patches.

That is absolutely right. No one is fooled by the claim that
it is open-source and yet only have available the compiled
apps to install.

It is not much different with the sources for linux code. Not
everyone even would know what to look for to identify
nefarious bits of code. Users just fetch the applications and
the updates, compile, and go.

A bit of a history. Russian government asked Telegram to
share the cryptographic keys. Telegram rejected to
cooperate..

Yes, I read about that just prior to your post. But I didn't
know that Russia removed the ban *this year*. I suppose Stas
wouldn't have dared to operate Telegram while it being banned.
Good to know that he has freedom to use it now.

Pavel Durov.. Recently he was talking shit about Apple
and Google 30% app store commission and how cruel they
are.

Hmmmm. Yeah, Why would he *need* to do that? :/

Anyway, suddenly Russian government has removed the
ban and Telegram was unblocked in Russia.

Yes.. very suspect. If the Durov's have emmigrated, why would
they need to *now* cower to the Russian gov't? Is it because
of threats and pressure to their families who they left behind
or something?

... but it was government direct order to unblock. It
definitely shows Durov cooperation.

Yes. Suspicious.

So, do you think that the secret-chats feature is not so
secret?



--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.46
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello, August!

Sunday September 13 2020 00:43, from August Abolins -> Nil Alexandrov:

That is absolutely right. No one is fooled by the claim that
it is open-source and yet only have available the compiled
apps to install.

You can compile yourself and install an .apk file on your Android device, though on iOS it's not possible at all (without a developer license or limited to emulation only).

It is not much different with the sources for linux code. Not
everyone even would know what to look for to identify
nefarious bits of code. Users just fetch the applications and
the updates, compile, and go.

At least you have choices. LFS (Linux From Scratch) project is what you are looking for.

Pavel Durov.. Recently he was talking shit about Apple
and Google 30% app store commission and how cruel they
are.

Hmmmm. Yeah, Why would he *need* to do that? :/

Another reason for him to hate the US and big US high-tech companies is the shutdown of the Telegram TON cryptocurrency project. You cannot just bring in something that will be out of the government control and regulations and big high-tech companies have been always cooperating.

Yes.. very suspect. If the Durov's have emmigrated, why would
they need to *now* cower to the Russian gov't? Is it because
of threats and pressure to their families who they left behind
or something?

I guess he is a grown up man now, finally realized that pee against the wind is not the way to go.

... but it was government direct order to unblock. It
definitely shows Durov cooperation.

Yes. Suspicious.
So, do you think that the secret-chats feature is not so
secret?

Any government will not freely allows popular way of communication be lack of a backdoor for monitoring, period.

Best Regards, Nil
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
* Origin: -=NIL BBS=- (2:5015/46)

Hi, August!

13 ᥭ 20 04:42, August Abolins -> Charles Pierson:

Oh.. and I forgot to ask, is Telegram the only one among the other messenger apps that is open-source?

They say that Viber also has free bots ...

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

--- ‘â뤭® ¡ë¢ ¥â ⮫쪮 §  â®, çâ® ¯®¬­¨èì. €«ª®£®«ì.
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/5858)

Hi, August!

Yes, I read about that just prior to your post. But I didn't
know that Russia removed the ban *this year*. I suppose Stas
wouldn't have dared to operate Telegram while it being banned.
Good to know that he has freedom to use it now.

These are stereotypes - "Russian vodka, balalaika, bears ..." Nothing like this happens here. What is such a ban? Everything works and worked for me. Especially when you consider that formally, for Crimeans, most of the Internet resources are closed by their owners, mind you, and not by Russian officials. Even our children know how to get around these prohibitions.

Well, you made me fun, honestly. ;)

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

--- Œã¦ ¡¥§ ¦¥­ë - ª ª ¤ã¡ ¡¥§ ¤ïâ« .
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/5858)

Answering a msg from Stas Mishchenkov:

Hi, August!

Yes, I read about that just prior to your post. But I didn't
know that Russia removed the ban *this year*. I suppose Stas
wouldn't have dared to operate Telegram while it being banned.
Good to know that he has freedom to use it now.

These are stereotypes - "Russian vodka, balalaika, bears ..." Nothing like this happens here. What is such a ban? Everything works and worked for me. Especially when you consider that formally, for Crimeans, most of the Internet resources are closed by their owners, mind you, and not by Russian officials. Even our children know how to get around these prohibitions.

Well, you made me fun, honestly. ;)

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

Much like the President here threatening to ban the TikTok app my granddaughters seem to love so well. They can try, but people will find their own way.


--- tg2fido.pl
* Origin: Telegram to fido gate by Stas Mishchenkov (2:460/58)

Hi, Charles!

13 ᥭ 20 22:49, Charles Pierson -> Stas Mishchenkov:

Much like the President here threatening to ban the TikTok app my granddaughters seem to love so well. They can try, but people will
find their own way.

My son is eleven years old. When I banned some sites on the router, hi hacked the Wi-Fi of the neighbors. ;)

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

--- Š®­ìª¨ ¨ « áâë - çâ® á㦤¥­® ®â¡à®á¨âì, ⮣® 㦥 ­¥ ᪫¥¨èì...
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/5858)

Hello Stas!

** On Sunday 13.09.20 - 23:00, Stas Mishchenkov wrote to Charles Pierson:

My son is eleven years old. When I banned some sites on
the router, hi hacked the Wi-Fi of the neighbors. ;)

He was probably watching you VERY closely!

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.46
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello Charles!

** On Sunday 13.09.20 - 22:49, Charles Pierson wrote to Stas Mishchenkov:

Much like the President here threatening to ban the
TikTok app my granddaughters seem to love so well. They
can try, but people will find their own way.

Yes.. people will just be driven underground to get around the
bans.

But if tiktok is known to scrape private information from the
phones that it is being used on, that's not so great. It is
sad that young people are willing to give up privacy for the
sake of dancing on a teeny tiny screen.

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.46
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello Stas!

** On Sunday 13.09.20 - 22:39, Stas Mishchenkov wrote to August Abolins:

These are stereotypes - "Russian vodka, balalaika, bears
..." Nothing like this happens here. What is such a ban?
Everything works and worked for me. Especially when you
consider that formally, for Crimeans, most of the
Internet resources are closed by their owners, mind you,
and not by Russian officials. Even our children know how
to get around these prohibitions.

The reports of a ban from the gov't is not a stereotype. It's
just bad media reporting, I guess. Maybe the truth gets lost
in translation.

There is probably more to the story about Telegram (the
backdoors, encryption, etc) that we will probably never learn
all about.

Well, you made me fun, honestly. ;)

You mean I made you laugh? OK then.

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.46
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello Nil!

** On Sunday 13.09.20 - 18:35, Nil Alexandrov wrote to August Abolins:

You can compile yourself and install an .apk file on your
Android device, though on iOS it's not possible at all
(without a developer license or limited to emulation
only).

Nice. So, if your compiled version matches in size and
checksum, then we can be confident that the ready-made version
is legit?

Yes. Suspicious.
So, do you think that the secret-chats feature is not so
secret?

Any government will not freely allows popular way of
communication be lack of a backdoor for monitoring,
period.

Hmmm.. maybe there is a backdoor to the backdoor? <g>

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.46
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello, August!

Sunday September 13 2020 18:09, from August Abolins -> Nil Alexandrov:

You can compile yourself and install an .apk file on your
Android device, though on iOS it's not possible at all
(without a developer license or limited to emulation
only).

Nice. So, if your compiled version matches in size and
checksum, then we can be confident that the ready-made version
is legit?

Not that easy. First, there might be variance in environment and compile and libraries versions so that the result binary differs. On top of that the app has to be sign and stuff. I am not a mobile developer but suspect that you just cannot do the binary comparison here.

Any government will not freely allows popular way of
communication be lack of a backdoor for monitoring,
period.

Hmmm.. maybe there is a backdoor to the backdoor? <g>

It is called cooperation, not the blackdoor.

Best Regards, Nil
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
* Origin: -=NIL BBS=- (2:5015/46)

Stas Mishchenkov wrote to Charles Pierson <=-

My son is eleven years old. When I banned some sites on the router, hi hacked the Wi-Fi of the neighbors. ;)

My neighbor's router credentials are admin/password. Not too hard to
figure out.

The kids have learned to use the cell networks on their phone to get
around our wifi parental controls. I've told both of the kids that I
reserve the right to inspect their phones and for us to discuss any
inappropriate content in a non-judgemental manner. It might be time
for that nuclear option.



... Start where you are. Use what you have. Do what you can.
--- MultiMail/XT v0.52
* Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org | tomorrow's retro tech (1:218/700)

August,

According to the following site, Telegram usage by monthly active users
is pretty low: https://www.statista.com/statistics/350461/mobile-messenger-app-usage-us a/

I used to use the Telegram utility on a ham radio net, but since I'm no longer part of the net, I no longer use it.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... If you hear an Onion Ring, please answer it.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - tbolt.synchro.net (1:19/33)

Hello, Daryl Stout.
On 9/13/20 10:26 AM you wrote:

August,

According to the following site, Telegram usage by monthly active
users is pretty low:
https://www.statista.
com/statistics/350461/mobile-messenger-app-usage-us a/

I used to use the Telegram utility on a ham radio net, but since
I'm no
longer part of the net, I no longer use it.

That's interesting. Did it connect with that net, or was it a separate tool?

--
Best regards!
Posted using Hotdoged on Android
--- Hotdoged/2.13.5/Android
* Origin: The Oasis, Houston, Texas, USA (2:240/1120.976)

Hello, Charles Pierson.
On 9/13/20 10:49 PM you wrote:

These are stereotypes - "Russian vodka, balalaika, bears ..."
Nothing like this happens here. What is such a ban? Everything
works and worked for me. Especially when you consider that
formally, for Crimeans, most of the Internet resources are closed
by their owners, mind you, and not by Russian officials. Even our
children know how to get around these prohibitions.

Wait, you mean there are no bears in Russia?

I've been lied to my entire life!

--
Best regards!
Posted using Hotdoged on Android
--- Hotdoged/2.13.5/Android
* Origin: The Oasis, Houston, Texas, USA (2:240/1120.976)

Hello, Daryl!

Sunday September 13 2020 10:26, from Daryl Stout -> August Abolins:

I used to use the Telegram utility

Pardon? You said utility? Though we are talking about telegram app here.

on a ham radio net, but since I'm no longer part of the net, I no
longer use it.

Don't see the connection between Telegram and your ham network. Does your HAM club use the Telegram for group texting sort of?

Me personally, I'm on and off HAM operator.

Daryl, WX4QZ

!73 DE KC1GSH

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
* Origin: -=NIL BBS=- (2:5015/46)

Hi, August!

13 ᥭ 20 17:39, August Abolins -> Stas Mishchenkov:

My son is eleven years old. When I banned some sites on
the router, hi hacked the Wi-Fi of the neighbors. ;)

He was probably watching you VERY closely!

Of course, he learned from me. However, he still had to figure out that he could take the Internet elsewhere.

Have nice nights.
Brother Rabbit.

--- ‘¢®¡®¤­ ï ¡ ¡  ¤®«¦­  ¯®ª §ë¢ âì á¨á쪨. ‡ ¬ã¦­ïï ­¥ ¤®«¦­ ,­® ⮦¥ ¢¯à ¢¥
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/58.10)

Hi, August!

13 ᥭ 20 17:55, August Abolins -> Stas Mishchenkov:

The reports of a ban from the gov't is not a stereotype.

We have no such thing as a government ban. It's just that some dumb officials try too hard to show their loyalty.

Some blockages do exist, but these are drug sites and other child pornography. I would still hack all this on my router, but only more accurately and playfully.

It's just bad media reporting, I guess.

It's not news at all that the media loves to turn a fly into an elephant.

Maybe the truth gets lost in translation.

Yes. The language barrier makes one speak in simple sentences and sometimes because of this the subtle meaning of what is said is lost. I'm not even talking about the difficulty of understanding ideomatisms. (It's raining cats and dogs). :)


Have nice nights.
Brother Rabbit.

--- ‘¢®¡®¤­ ï ¡ ¡  ¤®«¦­  ¯®ª §ë¢ âì á¨á쪨. ‡ ¬ã¦­ïï ­¥ ¤®«¦­ ,­® ⮦¥ ¢¯à ¢¥
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/58.10)

Nil,

I used to use the Telegram utility

Pardon? You said utility? Though we are talking about telegram app
here.

It may be. I had it on the desktop, but can't remember if I had it on
the smartphone.

Don't see the connection between Telegram and your ham network. Does
your HAM club use the Telegram for group texting sort of?

Actually, yes...that's how the Net Controls communicated with each other during a net.

Me personally, I'm on and off HAM operator.

Daryl, WX4QZ

!73 DE KC1GSH

Good to see another hamming BBS User. <G>

Daryl

... I hate 4 letter words...cook, wash, dust, iron, work.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - tbolt.synchro.net (1:19/33)

Hello, Daryl!

Tuesday September 15 2020 01:07, from Daryl Stout -> Nil Alexandrov:

Me personally, I'm on and off HAM operator.

Daryl, WX4QZ

!73 DE KC1GSH

Good to see another hamming BBS User. <G>

You're welcome to the *amateur_radio* Fidonet echo where you can specifically find folks with BBS/Fido and HAM overlap.

Best Regards, Nil
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
* Origin: -=NIL BBS=- (2:5015/46)

You're welcome to the *amateur_radio* Fidonet echo where you can specifically find folks with BBS/Fido and HAM overlap.

I think I have it on the BBS, but I don't post any bulletins from
W1AW or Newsline or callsign updates, as I think that's already being
done. But, if the moderator doesn't mind, I can add those to that.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... I'm Droopy Of Borg. You know what?? You're about to be assimilated.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - tbolt.synchro.net (1:19/33)