Alexey Vissarionov wrote to Nick Andre <=-

Actually, we don't need people who are _able_ to contribute
"something technically"... Instead, we need people who _do_
contribute.

Damn good point.

"Good intentions" accomplish.............. nothing.



... All the easy problems have been solved.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

On 03 Feb 21 16:36:36, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Nick Andre:

Actually, we don't need people who are _able_ to contribute "something technically"... Instead, we need people who _do_ contribute.

Great, lets give him the chance...

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Andrew Leary on Tue Feb 02 2021 09:07 am

On 02 Feb 21 02:33:28, Andrew Leary said the following to All:

Nick Andre 1:229/426

I'll stick around for another term if possible.

Nick

Now we need an RC to do the honors (grin, should be easy).

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

On 05 Feb 21 07:40:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to August Abolins

6. Nick Andre
Nothing.

I'd rather engage in nothing but being on stand-by for tech chat, than your lovely message thread in FTSC once upon a time about Tom Jennings being a "faggot". You were called out on this by several and I seem to recall you quickly retreated to the field of crickets chirping.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Good ${greeting_time}, Nick!

05 Feb 2021 03:13:20, you wrote to me:

6. Nick Andre
Nothing.

I'd rather engage in nothing but being on stand-by for tech chat,
than your lovely message thread in FTSC once upon a time about Tom Jennings being a "faggot".

Are you envied?

You were called out on this by several and I seem to recall you
quickly retreated to the field of crickets chirping.

Besides of disclosing the message posted in a private FTSC echoarea (and cherry-picking it out of the thread, of course), you are missing one very important point: TJ had done something for the Fidonet, while you had done nothing, and even hurt a little.


--
Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-ccxxix-lxxix-xlii

... god@universe:~ # cvs up && make world
--- /bin/vi
* Origin: ::1 (2:5020/545)

On 07 Feb 21 02:20:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Nick Andre:

Besides of disclosing the message posted in a private FTSC echoarea (and cherry-picking it out of the thread, of course), you are missing one very important point: TJ had done something for the Fidonet, while you had done nothing, and even hurt a little.

LOL, it wasn't from a "private" echoarea, it was all from here.

I'll be sure to re-post this every time you run your mouth at election
time about who contributes what. You sure gave all of us yours...

Date: 8:19 pm Sat Nov 10, 2018 Number : 6284 of 7936
From: Alexey Vissarionov Base : Fidonet/FTSC_PUBLIC
To : Ward Dossche Refer #: None
Subj: FTS-1 and FTS-4 Replies: None
Stat: Sent Origin : 11 Nov 18 03:14:16

Good ${greeting_time}, Ward!

11 Nov 2018 00:01:18, you wrote to me:

Yes. And now it's time to actualize it.

Interesting. Both Randy Bush and Tom Jennings have just threatened
to sue me if I endorse updating FTS-1.

Do you care of those faggots?

Let's do it ... :-)

... and do that so that they would die in agony of envy :-)


Your words, not mine. And heres another little gem amongst some of the flamage you received from other developers:

Date: 6:36 am Mon Nov 12, 2018 Number : 6309 of 7937
From: Alexey Vissarionov Base : Fidonet/FTSC_PUBLIC
To : Rob Swindell Refer #: None
Subj: FTS-1 and FTS-4 Replies: None
Stat: Sent Origin : 12 Nov 18 14:27:14

Good ${greeting_time}, Rob!

11 Nov 2018 14:36:58, you wrote to me:

Yes. And now it's time to actualize it.

Interesting. Both Randy Bush and Tom Jennings have just threatened
to sue me if I endorse updating FTS-1.

Do you care of those faggots?

Here in America, that's a pretty derogatory description to assign to someone. I don't care whether they are homosexual or not, but I don't think that disparagement is justified. :-(

People who threaten to sue others for "copyright infringement" (whatever that could mean) deserve even more derogatory words. Alas, my English is not that good, and I don't know these words.

And, once again, I'm happy I don't live in USA.


.........

Ahh yes, fantastic "contributions" from you and the classic "my English is not good" card others have pulled in the past when going down in flames. Yet you seem to articulate yourself extremely well when it comes to shoving your tech proposals down someone's throat or how much you hate America or anyone who is not a super Linux hacker in a hooded sweater listening to techno music.

Perhaps you should brush up on interaction-skills-101 before attempting to contribute anything else to that magical planet of human beings let alone attempting to engage in penis comparison contest.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Hello Alexey,

On Sun Feb 07 2021 02:20:00, Alexey Vissarionov wrote to Nick Andre:

Besides of disclosing the message posted in a private FTSC echoarea
(and cherry-picking it out of the thread, of course), you are missing
one very important point: TJ had done something for the Fidonet, while
you had done nothing, and even hurt a little.

But... The more shit talking and trolling you accomplish, the less you actually do in regards to Fidonet.

I've seen you do some great things for this network. But, when you resort to trolling and well, a couple of years of not doing a damn thing yourself since the FTSC has been dead as a doornail since I gave up on it.. The respect diminishes quickly.

Work together, for fuck's sake.

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20181215
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

On 07 Feb 21 18:42:04, Stas Mishchenkov said the following to Carol Shenkenberg

if will properly documented by the FTSC. However, to date, the PKT and MSG standard is still documented in FTS-0001, which is now practically not used anyone and the widely used corresponding formats are not documented. Does i

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used here.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Nick wrote (2021-02-07):

On 07 Feb 21 18:42:04, Stas Mishchenkov said the following to Carol Shenkenberg

if will properly documented by the FTSC. However, to date, the PKT
and MSG standard is still documented in FTS-0001, which is now
practically not used anyone and the widely used corresponding formats
are not documented. Does i

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used here.

Which part of it? Which PKT formats are used by your system? Please point to the FTSs that describe these formats.

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

On 07 Feb 21 18:31:57, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Which part of it? Which PKT formats are used by your system? Please point to the FTSs that describe these formats.

As per FTS-0001.016. Application B section 1 - Message storage. Section 2 - Schedules and events, specifically ZMH as I have a dialup modem line.

Application C - Presentation Layer section 1. Compatible packed message.

Application D - Session layer. All sections. All specification supported here.

Application F - Network layer. All sections. Everything supported here.

Application G - Data Link Layer. All sections. Everything accepted here.

Several more FTS's supported here not to mention EMSI which was invented by both Joaquim Homrighausen and the original D'Bridge author. But I added the frosting on the cake by directly integrating with the BinkD protocol specs so this system really is both a "true" hybrid dialup and Internet system.

That was done with the help of Ward Dossche... the guy whom I was told horror stories about and was called every name in the book, but has always been very nice to trade banter with. The guy who helped in July 2018 when I inherited a total mess from my ZC predecessor. You know, the one you cozy up with in Fidogazette. I rewrote that mess in two nights to make it "work". You know, to produce correct nodelists on time. But sure lets talk about FTS-0001...

So you may connect here using BinkD or make an international dialup modem call to Toronto Canada and connect as low as 300 baud to an IBM 7855 and initiate
a minimal Xmodem or Telink session if you wanted to. Maybe you prefer Yoohoo handshaking? Or try your hand at some WaZOO or Bark hackery?

I still receive the occasional dialup BBS call but for the sake of this discussion the last "serious" downlink I had that did Fido via. dialup was a non-profit BBS geared towards disabled/handicapped chatter that was running Wildcat and ViaMail on a 386 PC polling here at 2400 baud several times a
day. That was probably... uhhhh I'm guessing only 5 or 6 years ago and for some reason Telink worked better than EMSI but to be fair that was being done over a VOIP setup at the time.

Now the troll says what?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Hi, Nick!

07 䥢 21 11:29, Nick Andre -> Stas Mishchenkov:

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used here.

Where is it used?

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

--- �������� - �� �����⢮ ����� ���죨, �� ������ �������� 㤮�����⢨�.
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/5858)

On 08 Feb 21 16:54:04, Stas Mishchenkov said the following to Nick Andre:

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used here.

Where is it used?

On this system.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Hi, Nick!

08 䥢 21 09:25, Nick Andre -> Stas Mishchenkov:

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used

here.

Where is it used?

On this system.

Ah. Then, of course, it should not be brought in line with reality.

Have nice nights.
Stas Mishchenkov.

--- �������, � �� ��������, �� �� ���� ���� 㧭����.
* Origin: Lame Users Breeding. Simferopol, Crimea. (2:460/5858)

Nick wrote (2021-02-07):

On 07 Feb 21 18:31:57, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Which part of it? Which PKT formats are used by your system? Please
point to the FTSs that describe these formats.

As per FTS-0001.016. Application B section 1 - Message storage. Section 2 - Schedules and events, specifically ZMH as I have a dialup modem line.

Application C - Presentation Layer section 1. Compatible packed message.

Application D - Session layer. All sections. All specification supported here.

Application F - Network layer. All sections. Everything supported here.

Application G - Data Link Layer. All sections. Everything accepted here.

Several more FTS's supported here not to mention EMSI which was invented by both Joaquim Homrighausen and the original D'Bridge author. But I
added the frosting on the cake by directly integrating with the BinkD protocol specs so this system really is both a "true" hybrid dialup and Internet system.

That was done with the help of Ward Dossche... the guy whom I was told horror stories about and was called every name in the book, but has
always been very nice to trade banter with. The guy who helped in July 2018 when I inherited a total mess from my ZC predecessor. You know, the one you cozy up with in Fidogazette. I rewrote that mess in two nights to make it "work". You know, to produce correct nodelists on time. But sure lets talk about FTS-0001...

So you may connect here using BinkD or make an international dialup modem call to Toronto Canada and connect as low as 300 baud to an IBM 7855 and initiate a minimal Xmodem or Telink session if you wanted to. Maybe you prefer Yoohoo handshaking? Or try your hand at some WaZOO or Bark hackery?

I still receive the occasional dialup BBS call but for the sake of this discussion the last "serious" downlink I had that did Fido via. dialup
was a non-profit BBS geared towards disabled/handicapped chatter that was running Wildcat and ViaMail on a 386 PC polling here at 2400 baud several times a day. That was probably... uhhhh I'm guessing only 5 or 6 years
ago and for some reason Telink worked better than EMSI but to be fair
that was being done over a VOIP setup at the time.

Now the troll says what?

After starting with an answer for the first question, which transformed into raving about various ZCs in various ways, your mail suddenly stops here.

Are you intentionally avoiding the other questions?
Or do you have a short attention span and cannot resist the immediate urge to babble about the cool dude you think you are and how others suck?

Did you understand the questions from the previous mails?

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

On 09 Feb 21 10:19:30, Stas Mishchenkov said the following to Nick Andre:

I'm not sure where you get your facts from but FTS-0001 is used

here.

Where is it used?

On this system.

Ah. Then, of course, it should not be brought in line with reality.

What does that mean?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 09 Feb 21 10:48:55, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Are you intentionally avoiding the other questions?
Or do you have a short attention span and cannot resist the immediate urge t babble about the cool dude you think you are and how others suck?

Well for starters your nodelist-police Fido uplink happily mooches everything from here so that makes me a "cool dude" for running a system that allows you the freedom to be a douchebag character posting with one-name.

Which other questions? Elements of FTS-0001 are used on this system. What is
so wrong about that? I very politely answered your loaded questions with
cited sections that you asked for and gave perspective as to how things work here. I didn't have to reply at all but did because you asked. You're welcome.

Now the troll says what?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Hi Nick,

On 2021-02-09 07:07:59, you wrote to Oli:

Well for starters your nodelist-police Fido uplink happily mooches everything from here so that makes me a "cool dude" for running a
system that allows you the freedom to be a douchebag character posting with one-name.

Maybe you should check your config before you make such claims. I haven't had any connections to echomail or file areas on your system for almost a year...

Now the troll says what?

Your persistence to insult anyone who doesn't agree with your world view, says more about you then the ones you try to insult...


Bye, Wilfred.

--- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
* Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)

On 09 Feb 21 14:14:21, Wilfred Van Velzen said the following to Nick Andre:

Maybe you should check your config before you make such claims. I haven't h any connections to echomail or file areas on your system for almost a year.

So you say, but God help everyone if the nodelist is incorrect... right?

Your persistence to insult anyone who doesn't agree with your world view, s more about you then the ones you try to insult...

Its pretty simple. When someone questions me politely, I respond accordingly.

When someones questions are loaded with attitude or a stupid agenda or the person has trolled me elsewhere for quite some time, I respond accordingly.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Hi Nick,

On 2021-02-09 08:58:14, you wrote to me:

Maybe you should check your config before you make such claims. I
haven't h any connections to echomail or file areas on your system
for almost a year.

So you say,

I send the disconnect message myself and got a reply from your areafix, so there is no doubt...

Bye, Wilfred.

--- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
* Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Alexey Vissarionov on Sat Feb 06 2021 11:08 pm

On 07 Feb 21 02:20:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Nick Andre:

Besides of disclosing the message posted in a private FTSC echoarea (and cherry-picking it out of the thread, of course), you are missing one ver important point: TJ had done something for the Fidonet, while you had do nothing, and even hurt a little.

LOL, it wasn't from a "private" echoarea, it was all from here.

I'll be sure to re-post this every time you run your mouth at election
time about who contributes what. You sure gave all of us yours...

Date: 8:19 pm Sat Nov 10, 2018 Number : 6284 of 7936
From: Alexey Vissarionov Base : Fidonet/FTSC_PUBLIC
To : Ward Dossche Refer #: None
Subj: FTS-1 and FTS-4 Replies: None
Stat: Sent Origin : 11 Nov 18 03:14:16

Good ${greeting_time}, Ward!

11 Nov 2018 00:01:18, you wrote to me:

Yes. And now it's time to actualize it.

Interesting. Both Randy Bush and Tom Jennings have just threatened
to sue me if I endorse updating FTS-1.

Do you care of those faggots?

Let's do it ... :-)

... and do that so that they would die in agony of envy :-)

Your words, not mine. And heres another little gem amongst some of the flama you received from other developers:

Date: 6:36 am Mon Nov 12, 2018 Number : 6309 of 7937
From: Alexey Vissarionov Base : Fidonet/FTSC_PUBLIC
To : Rob Swindell Refer #: None
Subj: FTS-1 and FTS-4 Replies: None
Stat: Sent Origin : 12 Nov 18 14:27:14

Good ${greeting_time}, Rob!

11 Nov 2018 14:36:58, you wrote to me:

Yes. And now it's time to actualize it.

Interesting. Both Randy Bush and Tom Jennings have just threatened
to sue me if I endorse updating FTS-1.

Do you care of those faggots?

Here in America, that's a pretty derogatory description to assign to someone. I don't care whether they are homosexual or not, but I don't think that disparagement is justified. :-(

People who threaten to sue others for "copyright infringement" (whatever tha could mean) deserve even more derogatory words. Alas, my English is not that good, and I don't know these words.

And, once again, I'm happy I don't live in USA.

.........

Ahh yes, fantastic "contributions" from you and the classic "my English is n good" card others have pulled in the past when going down in flames. Yet you seem to articulate yourself extremely well when it comes to shoving your tec proposals down someone's throat or how much you hate America or anyone who i not a super Linux hacker in a hooded sweater listening to techno music.

Perhaps you should brush up on interaction-skills-101 before attempting to contribute anything else to that magical planet of human beings let alone attempting to engage in penis comparison contest.

Nick

Interaction skills would be good here.

xxcarol











--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Oli to Nick Andre on Tue Feb 09 2021 10:48 am

Nick wrote (2021-02-07):

On 07 Feb 21 18:31:57, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Which part of it? Which PKT formats are used by your system? Please
point to the FTSs that describe these formats.

As per FTS-0001.016. Application B section 1 - Message storage. Section - Schedules and events, specifically ZMH as I have a dialup modem line.

Application C - Presentation Layer section 1. Compatible packed message

Application D - Session layer. All sections. All specification supporte here.

Application F - Network layer. All sections. Everything supported here.

Application G - Data Link Layer. All sections. Everything accepted here

Several more FTS's supported here not to mention EMSI which was invente by both Joaquim Homrighausen and the original D'Bridge author. But I added the frosting on the cake by directly integrating with the BinkD protocol specs so this system really is both a "true" hybrid dialup and Internet system.

That was done with the help of Ward Dossche... the guy whom I was told horror stories about and was called every name in the book, but has always been very nice to trade banter with. The guy who helped in July 2018 when I inherited a total mess from my ZC predecessor. You know, th one you cozy up with in Fidogazette. I rewrote that mess in two nights make it "work". You know, to produce correct nodelists on time. But sur lets talk about FTS-0001...

So you may connect here using BinkD or make an international dialup mod call to Toronto Canada and connect as low as 300 baud to an IBM 7855 an initiate a minimal Xmodem or Telink session if you wanted to. Maybe you prefer Yoohoo handshaking? Or try your hand at some WaZOO or Bark hacke

I still receive the occasional dialup BBS call but for the sake of this discussion the last "serious" downlink I had that did Fido via. dialup was a non-profit BBS geared towards disabled/handicapped chatter that w running Wildcat and ViaMail on a 386 PC polling here at 2400 baud sever times a day. That was probably... uhhhh I'm guessing only 5 or 6 years ago and for some reason Telink worked better than EMSI but to be fair that was being done over a VOIP setup at the time.

Now the troll says what?

After starting with an answer for the first question, which transformed into raving about various ZCs in various ways, your mail suddenly stops here.

Are you intentionally avoiding the other questions?
Or do you have a short attention span and cannot resist the immediate urge t babble about the cool dude you think you are and how others suck?

Did you understand the questions from the previous mails?

We have some serious weather here just now and he may be caught in it.

Why so nasty at a 3 day delay?

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

Carol Shenkenberger wrote to Oli <=-

Are you intentionally avoiding the other questions?
Or do you have a short attention span and cannot resist the immediate urge t babble about the cool dude you think you are and how others suck?

Did you understand the questions from the previous mails?

We have some serious weather here just now and he may be caught
in it.

Why so nasty at a 3 day delay?

Because "Oli" is an asshole. That's what he does.



... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

Nick wrote (2021-02-09):

Which other questions? Elements of FTS-0001 are used on this system. What is so wrong about that? I very politely answered

Calling someone a troll is your definition of being polite?

Now the troll says what?

The troll says the he is amused that you are so occupied with your troll research and bullshitting that you don't recognize the elephant in the room (question). Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s) in use for decades? I start to believe that some members of the FTSC don't even understand the difference between FTS-0001 F.1. and what's in use today.

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

Dan wrote (2021-02-12):

Because "Oli" is an asshole. That's what he does.

Can someone please nominate Dan "Exploding Heads" Clough? I think he is highly qualified for the job.

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

Carol wrote (2021-02-11):

We have some serious weather here just now and he may be caught in it.

climate change and shit, tell me about it.

Why so nasty at a 3 day delay?

Sorry, I'm confused. Date/time in UTC:

Nick Sun 7 Feb 2021 20:02:03
Me Tue 9 Feb 2021 09:48:55
You Fri 12 Feb 2021 03:24:21

Are you sure your echomail feed is alright?

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

Hi Oli,

On 2021-02-12 14:50:41, you wrote to Nick Andre:

Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s) in
use for decades?

A couple of years back there was someone who put together a document describing the different pkt formats in use. It was discussed here, but I don't know what happend to it, because the name it was given:

Publication: FSP-1040 draft 3
Revision: 1
Title: Packet Type 2 Compatible Formats
Author: Stephen Hurd 1:103/1
Date: 2016-02-11

Is now in use for a different FSP:

fsp-1040.001 SRIF file request interface


Bye, Wilfred.

--- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
* Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)

Oli wrote to Dan Clough <=-

Because "Oli" is an asshole. That's what he does.

Can someone please nominate Dan "Exploding Heads" Clough? I think
he is highly qualified for the job.

Exploding heads? Not sure what you mean by that, but whatever.

Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?


... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

Oli wrote to Carol Shenkenberger <=-

We have some serious weather here just now and he may be caught in it.

climate change and shit, tell me about it.

Nope, that's not it. It's called.................... winter.

Happens every year, believe it or not.



... WORK HARDER!... Millions on welfare depend on YOU!
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Wilfred van Velzen to Oli on Fri Feb 12 2021 03:19 pm

Hi Oli,

On 2021-02-12 14:50:41, you wrote to Nick Andre:

Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s) in use for decades?

A couple of years back there was someone who put together a document describing the different pkt formats in use. It was discussed here, but I don't know what happend to it, because the name it was given:

Publication: FSP-1040 draft 3
Revision: 1
Title: Packet Type 2 Compatible Formats
Author: Stephen Hurd 1:103/1
Date: 2016-02-11

Multiple drafts were rejected for reasons the author didn't agree with (e.g. draft spec had to be submitted by splitting the text among multiple echomail messages, per stone-age FTSC submission requirements). So he gave up the effort and the FTSC discarded a rare high-quality technical contribution. Or at least, that's my recollection.
https://nix.synchro.net/msgs/msg.ssjs?msg_sub=fidoftscpub&message=7380
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

On 12 Feb 21 14:50:41, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Calling someone a troll is your definition of being polite?

You are a troll who (A) Started random shit with me quite some time ago
because "you can" and (B) Tries to take me to task technically but can't.

So you invent things to whine about, like this:

(question). Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s in use for decades? I start to believe that some members of the FTSC don't even understand the difference between FTS-0001 F.1. and what's in use today

If you believe the FTSC does not live up to your expectations, then do something about it and get involved instead of running your mouth. Nobody is stopping you. Kindof like what you were told recently by the Husky guys.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 12 Feb 21 18:59:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Richard Menedet

So I like to nominate:
Richard Menedetter 2:310/31

I accept.

You and Maurice seem to be the only "T" people in the coming FTSC... :-/

The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Alexey Vissarionov on Fri Feb 12 2021 08:08 pm

The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?

Just so long as the web-site is kept up, I don't see much difference.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
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On 12 Feb 21 18:34:17, Rob Swindell said the following to Nick Andre:

The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?

Just so long as the web-site is kept up, I don't see much difference.

Me neither.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to Wilfred van Velzen on Fri Feb 12 2021 16:28:07

Multiple drafts were rejected for reasons the author didn't agree
with (e.g. draft spec had to be submitted by splitting the text
among multiple echomail messages, per stone-age FTSC submission requirements). So he gave up the effort and the FTSC discarded a
rare high-quality technical contribution. Or at least, that's my recollection.

i forget the details but the document is on the FTSC table as FSP-1042 since 2019 Mar 26... the previous FSP number was recycled to the SRIF document when the FTSC chairperson at that time decided to no longer reserve document
numbers... there is a different chairperson, now... not sure if they are reserving document numbers or not, though...

the presented document has gone through a few edits to correct a few things... one was a table fix and the other was to fix a copy pasta error... aside from that, diff showed minor formatting changes shortening line widths...
at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...


)\/(ark
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 06:46 am

at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...

Can't find it on ftsc.org.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21

at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...

Can't find it on ftsc.org.

correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 04:07 pm

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21

at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...

Can't find it on ftsc.org.

correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...

I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a non-public forum?
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
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Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Oli to Nick Andre on Fri Feb 12 2021 02:50 pm

Nick wrote (2021-02-09):

Which other questions? Elements of FTS-0001 are used on this system. Wh is so wrong about that? I very politely answered

Calling someone a troll is your definition of being polite?

Now the troll says what?

The troll says the he is amused that you are so occupied with your troll research and bullshitting that you don't recognize the elephant in the room (question). Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s in use for decades? I start to believe that some members of the FTSC don't e understand the difference between FTS-0001 F.1. and what's in use today.

Because, no one has submitted one might be related...

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
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Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Oli to Carol Shenkenberger on Fri Feb 12 2021 03:20 pm

Carol wrote (2021-02-11):

We have some serious weather here just now and he may be caught in it.

climate change and shit, tell me about it.

Why so nasty at a 3 day delay?

Sorry, I'm confused. Date/time in UTC:

Nick Sun 7 Feb 2021 20:02:03
Me Tue 9 Feb 2021 09:48:55
You Fri 12 Feb 2021 03:24:21

Are you sure your echomail feed is alright?

It's fine. I don't live online so a reply a few days later is perfectly workable.

xxcarol
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Dan Clough to Oli on Fri Feb 12 2021 01:24 pm

Oli wrote to Dan Clough <=-

Because "Oli" is an asshole. That's what he does.

Can someone please nominate Dan "Exploding Heads" Clough? I think
he is highly qualified for the job.

Exploding heads? Not sure what you mean by that, but whatever.

Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?

... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 14:14:40

correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...

I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a non-public forum?

all documents, when selected by the FTSC, go through a similar process as was done originally with this document... at that time, there is no public feedback on the document... only the FTSC members are involved in that stage
of proofreading, analysis, refining, and modifying the document before it is approved or turned back for more refinement based on provided feedback... yes, it is kinda like double work on the same task... the initial work
being done by the originator and the next level being done by the FTSC members who elect to participate in the process...

in any case, when the previous work in this echo went silent, some FTSC members worked together to bring the last public version into the private FTSC area for further discussion, refinement, and eventual approval or denial...
they did not want to see the work that went into the document wasted... i was one of those... i'll let others speak up for themselves if they want it known of their participation and backing...

hopefully once this current (s)election process is over, the FTSC will return to the document and complete the process...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 02:14 pm

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 04:07 pm

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21

at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...

Can't find it on ftsc.org.

correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration

I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a non-public forum?

I'm confused too. Lets see if Andrew can find it. I do not recall it being sent in nor do I have archives back to 2019.

xxcarol
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 05:43 pm

I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a non-public forum?

all documents, when selected by the FTSC, go through a similar process as was done originally with this document... at that time, there is no public feedback on the document... only the FTSC members are involved in that stage of proofreading, analysis, refining, and modifying the document before it is approved or turned back for more refinement based on provided feedback... yes, it is kinda like double work on the same task... the initial work
being done by the originator and the next level being done by the FTSC members who elect to participate in the process...

I found a flaw in the document a while back, I don't remember the specifics now, but if I can't review the current draft, how am I supposed to know if the flaw has been addressed or not?
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
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Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 15:00:17

I found a flaw in the document a while back, I don't remember the specifics now, but if I can't review the current draft, how am I supposed to know if the flaw has been addressed or not?

well, you wouldn't know... hopefully it was found but it is possible it has not yet been discovered... the document is still on the desk... i can't really say more and may have already said too much... i've not yet been
reprimanded by any other FTSC members but i'm going to hold off posting more...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
* Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)

Carol Shenkenberger wrote to Dan Clough <=-

Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is
"obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?



... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

Hello Carol!

13 Feb 21 17:43, you wrote to Rob Swindell:

I'm confused too. Lets see if Andrew can find it. I do not recall it being sent in nor do I have archives back to 2019.

I have FSP-1042.001 draft 6 here. As soon as the election is over with, we can get back to work on it.

Andrew

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
* Origin: Phoenix BBS * phoenix.bnbbbs.net (1:320/219)

Hello Dan!

13 Feb 21 19:42, you wrote to Carol Shenkenberger:

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is "obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

That is not correct.

Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?

I, as the FTSC Administrator, am the moderator of this echo. Unfortunately, for the reasons posted earlier by Nick Andre, it is difficult to enforce echo rules, and even more difficult or impossible to cut the feed to a repeated offender.

Andrew


--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
* Origin: Phoenix BBS * phoenix.bnbbbs.net (1:320/219)

On 14 Feb 21 11:09:05, Tom De Puysseleyr said the following to Andrew Leary:

The following members' terms expire on 11 Mar 2021:
Nick Andre 1:229/426

I hereby nominate Nick Andre.

I accept.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Andrew Leary wrote to Dan Clough <=-

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is "obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

That is not correct.

Well, effectively speaking, it is. The evidence is right before us.

Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?

I, as the FTSC Administrator, am the moderator of this echo. Unfortunately, for the reasons posted earlier by Nick Andre, it
is difficult to enforce echo rules, and even more difficult or
impossible to cut the feed to a repeated offender.

I understand that. Have you, as the moderator, told this offender,
either publicly or privately, that he is violating the rules? While it
is certainly *difficult* to enforce the rules, that's not the same thing
as *not* *even* *trying* to enforce the rules.

At least make the token effort? It's a process.



... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

Hello Wilfred,

On Fri Feb 12 2021 15:19:24, Wilfred van Velzen wrote to Oli:

A couple of years back there was someone who put together a document describing the different pkt formats in use. It was discussed here,
but I don't know what happend to it, because the name it was given:

Publication: FSP-1040 draft 3
Revision: 1
Title: Packet Type 2 Compatible Formats
Author: Stephen Hurd 1:103/1
Date: 2016-02-11

That was me, I believe. Because Stephen Hurd already knew where it would end up with the FTSC. And he was right. 3+ drafts of spelling/grammar checks, and ended up on the backburner, and eventually in the bit bucket. I learned my lesson quickly.

Is now in use for a different FSP:

fsp-1040.001 SRIF file request interface

Sounds about right!

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20181215
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hello Rob,

On Fri Feb 12 2021 16:28:06, Rob Swindell wrote to Wilfred van Velzen:

Multiple drafts were rejected for reasons the author didn't agree with (e.g. draft spec had to be submitted by splitting the text among
multiple echomail messages, per stone-age FTSC submission
requirements). So he gave up the effort and the FTSC discarded a rare high-quality technical contribution. Or at least, that's my
recollection. https://nix.synchro.net/msgs/msg.ssjs?msg_sub=fidoftscpub&message=7380

Sounds about right. ;)

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20181215
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Dan Clough to Carol Shenkenberger on Sat Feb 13 2021 07:42 pm

Carol Shenkenberger wrote to Dan Clough <=-

Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is "obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?

... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52

I suspect by defaulr it is Andrew Leary?

I don't mind Oli too much but it's obviously a handle. Impression is if you havent the honesty tp post with a real name, 'why should we listen'?

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
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Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Andrew Leary to Carol Shenkenberger on Sun Feb 14 2021 02:21 am

Hello Carol!

13 Feb 21 17:43, you wrote to Rob Swindell:

I'm confused too. Lets see if Andrew can find it. I do not recall it being sent in nor do I have archives back to 2019.

I have FSP-1042.001 draft 6 here. As soon as the election is over with, we can get back to work on it.

Andrew

Good. Need a RC recommendation still for you?

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Andrew Leary to Carol Shenkenberger on Sun Feb 14 2021 02:21 am

Hello Carol!

13 Feb 21 17:43, you wrote to Rob Swindell:

I'm confused too. Lets see if Andrew can find it. I do not recall it being sent in nor do I have archives back to 2019.

I have FSP-1042.001 draft 6 here. As soon as the election is over with, we can get back to work on it.

Andrew

Good. I simply do not recall a 2016 draft in 2021.

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
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Hello Nick!

14 Feb 21 08:15, you wrote to Tom De Puysseleyr:

I hereby nominate Nick Andre.

I accept.

ACK.

Andrew
FTSC Election Coordinator

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
* Origin: Phoenix BBS * phoenix.bnbbbs.net (1:320/219)

Nick wrote (2021-02-12):

On 12 Feb 21 14:50:41, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

Calling someone a troll is your definition of being polite?

You are a troll who

no, YOU are the troll ... ;)

(A) Started random shit with me quite some time ago
because "you can" and

.... who is living in his own reality distortion field. One of the last times you tried to troll me we weren't even in any discussion nor was my mail about you. But because "you can" you have no problem throwing sexist shit at people out of nowhere:

So what? Are you that insecure about yourself?

We can find some cranberry juice and Midol for your period, sweetheart.

Everything you accuse others of is exactly the BS you are doing. Should I compile a best of nasty things Nick Andre the troll said?

(B) Tries to take me to task technically but can't.

You rather derail the discussion than engage in the technical details. The "very stable genius" move?

So you invent things to whine about, like this:

(question). Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet
format(s in use for decades? I start to believe that some members of
the FTSC don't even understand the difference between FTS-0001 F.1.
and what's in use today

How is that an invention? See, FSC-0039/45/48 and discussions about FSP-1042.

If you believe the FTSC does not live up to your expectations, then do something about it and get involved instead of running your mouth. Nobody is stopping you. ...

That is such an cheap excuse. The FTSC is exactly there for documenting standards in use. Asking people to elect you as an FTSC member and than throwing up your hands telling everyone you're not responsible for anything and rather do nothing than [something worse than nothing] only shows that you are more interested in wearing another hat than in the work the FTSC should be doing.

to be continued ...

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

.... continuance

Nick wrote (2021-02-12):

... Kindof like what you were told recently by the Husky guys.

How is that different than your comment about semaphores in BINKD?

I asked for the same thing over the years. I'm wondering why the
arrogance insist that we kill things by Pid instead of telling
the program to exit gracefully.

You could have easily fixed it yourself. But did it matter? In the end digital man discovered and fixed a simple bug. Everybody's happy.

At the moment andrew clarke is doing excellent work in opening a can of worms that leads back to the Squish MsgAPI. For me it all started when Wilfred and mark lewis told me about problems with Squish and dupes in the MUFFIN echo.

Subject: Squish on Linux (compile errors)
Date: 21 Nov 2019 20:44:25 +0100
MSGID: 2:280/464 5dd6ea30

There's also the problem that the squish message base stores date/time stamps with a resolution of 2 seconds. That has been causing problems in the past where a squish system forwarded messages to its other links with the date/times changed from the original, and so causing undetected dupes on some systems.

Date: 22 Nov 2019 19:19:14 -0500
MSGID: 1:3634/12.73 5dd87e2e

we specifically tracked
this modified time stamp problem down several years ago... every message coming via squish had the seconds in multiples of two... no odd numbers
at all...

By reading the Squish Developer Kit documentation and some test that theory turned out to be wrong for the Squish tosser. There is also this remark in Squish's msgapi.h:

byte __ftsc_date[20];
/* Obsolete date information. If it weren't for the *
* fact that FTSC standards say that one cannot *
* modify an in-transit message, I'd be VERY *
* tempted to axe this field entirely, and recreate *
* an FTSC-compatible date field using *
* the information in 'date_written' upon *
* export. Nobody should use this field, except *
* possibly for tossers and scanners. All others *
* should use one of the two binary datestamps, *
* above. */


But I also didn't believe that Wilfred and mark just invented a problem that never existed. Maybe another tosser that supports Squish message bases? Husky's hpt was the most obvious first candidate to look at. Tests with pass-through / one-pass tossing didn't show any problems. But later I could reproduce the problem by rescanning mails from a Squish message base ("%RESCAN AREA"). The newest finding is that hpt also modifies the time stamp for rescanned mails from a JAM message base.

If you think this is all motivated by an urge to troll people, you really should check your definition of trolling. But I doubt you care. You're throwing shit at the wall until something sticks.

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

mark wrote (2021-02-13):

I found a flaw in the document a while back, I don't remember the
specifics now, but if I can't review the current draft, how am I
supposed to know if the flaw has been addressed or not?

well, you wouldn't know... hopefully it was found but it is possible it has not yet been discovered... the document is still on the desk... i can't really say more and may have already said too much... i've not yet been reprimanded by any other FTSC members but i'm going to hold off posting more...

This seems a bit of a silly process. 5 years since 2016. Mysterious things are being done behind the scenes. FTSC members don't even know about it or pretend to know nothing about it? Why not use an transparent, public and open process like the IETF and XSF. They are getting things done.

Even a not so perfect and not final proposal(!) for a documentation of Type 2+/.2 packet headers is better than what you can find on today's ftsc.org site.

---
* Origin: . (2:280/464.47)

On 15 Feb 21 11:43:02, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

If you think this is all motivated by an urge to troll people, you really should check your definition of trolling. But I doubt you care. You're throwing shit at the wall until something sticks.

Anyone who feels the urge to reply with two long messages of effeminate quoted nonsense has a serious mental problem.

End of thread, Bono.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Oli to Nick Andre on Mon Feb 15 2021 11:43 am

How is that different than your comment about semaphores in BINKD?

I asked for the same thing over the years. I'm wondering why the arrogance insist that we kill things by Pid instead of telling
the program to exit gracefully.

You could have easily fixed it yourself. But did it matter? In the end digital man discovered and fixed a simple bug. Everybody's happy.

I'm not sure I fixed anything as Nick never provided any test reports. <shrug> --- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

On 15 Feb 21 12:00:15, Rob Swindell said the following to Oli:

I'm not sure I fixed anything as Nick never provided any test reports. <shr

I haven't had the time yet. I'm sure its fine.

I did email you about an aspect of the Zmodem spec, did you get that?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Rob Swindell on Mon Feb 15 2021 03:11 pm

On 15 Feb 21 12:00:15, Rob Swindell said the following to Oli:

I'm not sure I fixed anything as Nick never provided any test reports. <shr

I haven't had the time yet. I'm sure its fine.

I did email you about an aspect of the Zmodem spec, did you get that?

I didn't see it cause it inexplicably ended up in my junk folder. I'll reply now.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

On 15 Feb 21 12:36:22, Rob Swindell said the following to Nick Andre:

I did email you about an aspect of the Zmodem spec, did you get that?

I didn't see it cause it inexplicably ended up in my junk folder. I'll repl now.

Got it, thanks.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)