Michael Mrak wrote to All <=-
In recent weeks, I have only passively followed the discussion here. It
is frustrating for me to see that the political climate in the USA has
now been completely destroyed.
I know this in a similar form in many European countries where
democracy is undermined with exactly the same tricks.
From this point of view, it is also interesting for me to read which bizarre arguments are presented here by the far-right Trump supporters.
A mixture of fear-mongering, false reports and denial of reality
against which, unfortunately, you can't fight with factual arguments at all.
As in Europe, the political elite is paralyzing itself in this way, and the people who are willing to reform and are looking to the future are being massively prevented from changing anything for the better by reactionary circles sowing falsehoods.
There are so many really important issues for the future that can only
be solved globally.
It's enough to make your hair stand on end. I also experience it
(reading) here: No effort for consensus, poisoned atmosphere. No focus
on the real challenges of our planet.
This makes me infinitely sad,
it shows that mankind is stagnating and
unfortunately proves again and again that it is not capable of
learning. Only we are slowly running out of options, as a planet I
mean.
[More nonsense from Ron deleted.]Michael Mrak wrote to All <=-The normal Leftie set up for deflection of blame for what HE does.
In recent weeks, I have only passively followed the discussion here. is frustrating for me to see that the political climate in the USA ha now been completely destroyed.
Oh, we are learning. We are learning that Lefties cannot be trusted. Lefties have no honor. Lefties don't honor rule of law. Lefties have
no standards (other than double standards). Lefties lie like everyone else breathes.
On 07-18-21 18:54, Ron Lauzon <=-Editing done to make Ron's post much closer to reality.
spoke to Michael Mrak about Re: Political momentum <=-
Michael Mrak wrote to All <=-
In recent weeks, I have only passively followed the discussion here. It
is frustrating for me to see that the political climate in the USA has
now been completely destroyed.
The normal Trumper set up for deflection of blame for what HE does.
I know this in a similar form in many European countries where
democracy is undermined with exactly the same tricks.
With a false "fact" to highlight his narrative.
From this point of view, it is also interesting for me to read which bizarre arguments are presented here by the far-right Trump supporters.
There's a trick question that goes like this: You are
somewhere on Earth. The
only way you can go is South. Where are you?
The obvious answer is "The North Pole". When you are at
the extreme North, all
directions are South.
For the Trumpers, anyone not blindly following their false narrative is
"a leftie" but they insist on portraying themselves as "middle of the road."
A mixture of fear-mongering, false reports and denial of reality
against which, unfortunately, you can't fight with factual arguments at all.
No you can't. That's why Trumpers create a false Narrative and push it hard through the Propaganda machine.
As in Europe, the political elite is paralyzing itself in this way, and the people who are willing to reform and are looking to the future are being massively prevented from changing anything for the better by reactionary circles sowing falsehoods.
Sounds just like what the Trumpers do. Anyone trying to counter the
false Trumper
Narrative is slienced. Just like in every socialist country.
There are so many really important issues for the future that can only
be solved globally.
It's enough to make your hair stand on end. I also experience it
(reading) here: No effort for consensus, poisoned atmosphere. No focus
on the real challenges of our planet.
You can't get consensus when the Trumpers cannot accept reality and intelligent people won't accept the False Narrative.
This makes me infinitely sad,
The term "crocodile tears" comes to mind here.
it shows that mankind is stagnating and
unfortunately proves again and again that it is not capable of
learning. Only we are slowly running out of options, as a planet I
mean.
Oh, we are learning. We are learning that Trumpers cannot be trusted. Trumpers have no honor. Trumpers don't honor rule of law. Trumpers have no standards (other than double standards). Trumpers lie like everyone else breathes.
His final statement highlights the fact that the Trumpers are scared because we are on to them and their lies. We've stopped listening to
the Propaganda ministry. We've stopped buying from their converged companies. We've started to take our schools back because we've recognized that they are brainwashing the kids. And in 2022, many Trumpers will be ousted from their seats in politics at the state and federal levels.
Jeff Squires wrote to Ron Lauzon <=-
You forgot the everything the left touches it destroys....
Dale Shipp wrote to Ron Lauzon <=-
On 07-18-21 18:54, Ron Lauzon <=-
spoke to Michael Mrak about Re: Political momentum <=-
Editing done to make Ron's post much closer to reality.
On 07-20-21 09:01, Ron Lauzon <=-
spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Political momentum <=-
Editing done to make Ron's post much closer to reality.
You have no comprehension of what reality is.
Dale Shipp wrote to Ron Lauzon <=-
I have a much better comprehension of reality than any Trumper.
I have a much better comprehension of reality than any Trumper.Lefties have no idea of reality or human nature. That's why their policies always fail.
Editing done to make Ron's post much closer to reality.
You have no comprehension of what reality is.
"Trickle-down economics" is among the most failed policies in American history.
Schizophrenia is a kind of psychosis, which means your mind
does not agree with reality. Please do seek professional help.
On 07-21-21 08:02, Ron Lauzon <=-
spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Political momentum <=-
I have a much better comprehension of reality than any Trumper.
Says the person who has allied with the people who think that a man
can give birth.
Schizophrenia is a kind of psychosis, which means your mind
does not agree with reality. Please do seek professional help.
Lee, kindly go take a long walk off a short pier....
"Trickle-down economics" is among the most failed policies in America history.Hah, have you ever got a job from a poor person? People who have money start businesses that hire people to help run there businesses. What doesn't work is socialism... never has, never will.
Lee Lofaso wrote to Ron Lauzon <=-
Schizophrenia is a kind of psychosis, which means your mind
does not agree with reality. Please do seek professional help.
Jeff Squires wrote to Jeff Thiele <=-
Hah, have you ever got a job from a poor person? People who have money start businesses that hire people to help run there businesses. What doesn't work is socialism... never has, never will.
Hah, have you ever got a job from a poor person? People who have mon start businesses that hire people to help run there businesses. What doesn't work is socialism... never has, never will.But people like the other Jeff want socialism because they are worthless people in society. They see themselves better off because they think
that they will be given stuff (taken from others who actually earn it,
of course).
Jeremiah was a bullfrog
Was a good friend of mine
I never understood a single word he said
But I helped him a-drink his wine
And he always had some mighty fine wine
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How
do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of
it?
Schizophrenia is a kind of psychosis, which means your mind
does not agree with reality. Please do seek professional help.
Maybe you can recommend your shrink. You are seeking help, right?
I have a much better comprehension of reality than any Trumper.
Says the person who has allied with the people who think that a man
can give birth.
I have no idea who you might be talking about -- and I am not allied
with any such group or person. You are stretching in order to come up with a response. Clear evidence that you have no legitimate response.
Jeff Squires wrote to Jeff Thiele <=-
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How
do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of
it?
We have ALWAYS had trickle down economics.... It is called capitalism.
You work hard create a company that becomes successful and hire people
and pay them. They intern spend there pay buying things they need and want.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. H do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction o it?We have ALWAYS had trickle down economics.... It is called capitalism.
You work hard create a company that becomes successful and hire people
and pay them. They intern spend there pay buying things they need and want.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. H do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction o it?The funny thing is that Lefties also want trickle-down economics. The only difference is how much wealth trickles down from the top.
We have ALWAYS had trickle down economics.... It is called capitalism You work hard create a company that becomes successful and hire peopl and pay them. They intern spend there pay buying things they need and want.
In the Leftie world, they **believe** that most wealth will trickle
down, but reality (as shown in EVERY socialist country) is that little wealth will actually trickle down and the Elites will keep most of it.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. H do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction o it?The funny thing is that Lefties also want trickle-down economics. The only difference is how much wealth trickles down from the top.
We have ALWAYS had trickle down economics.... It is called capitalism You work hard create a company that becomes successful and hire peopl and pay them. They intern spend there pay buying things they need and want.
"Trickle-down economics" is among the most failed policies in AmericHah, have you ever got a job from a poor person? People who have money start businesses that hire people to help run there businesses. What doesn't work is socialism... never has, never will.
history.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of it?
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of it?Immediately before, I think it was called stagflation.
Jeremiah was a bullfrog
Was a good friend of mine
I never understood a single word he said
But I helped him a-drink his wine
And he always had some mighty fine wine
May I have your attention, please?
May I have your attention, please?
Will the real Slim Shady please stand up?
I repeat, will the real Slim Shady please stand up?
We're gonna have a problem here
Y'all act like you never seen a white person before
Jaws all on the floor like Pam like Tommy just burst in the door
And started whoopin' her ass worse than before
They first were divorced, throwin' her over furniture (agh!)
It's the return of the "ah, wait, no way, you're kidding
He didn't just say what I think he did, did he?"
And Dr. Dre said, nothing, you idiots!
Dr. Dre's dead, he's locked in my basement (ha ha!)
Feminist women love Eminem
in Americ"Trickle-down economics" is among the most failed policies
history.
Hah, have you ever got a job from a poor person? People who have
money
start businesses that hire people to help run there businesses. What
doesn't work is socialism... never has, never will.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How do
you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of it?
Immediately before, I think it was called stagflation.
Reagan put an end to all that with his "voodoo economics" program
of supply-side economics (dreamed up by David Stockman). Official unemployment rates skyrocketed in Louisiana to over 25% - the real unemployment being well over 50%.
Um, no. "Trickle-down economics," or "voodoo economics" as the elder Bush called it, was introduced by Reagan. I suggest you do a little research
on that.
That's exactly where we are today due to Reaganomics, Ron. Prior to Reagan's "trickle-down economics," there was much less wealth disparity
in the US than there is today, 40 years later.
Um, no. "Trickle-down economics," or "voodoo economics" as the elder called it, was introduced by Reagan. I suggest you do a little resear on that.Don't need to, I know exactly what it is. Government stays out of the
way of business ie: high taxes and red tape and business make money that is in turn goes out into the economy.... Capitalism...
Here's one for you, what is the purpose of our government?
The Truth is out there ...
That's exactly where we are today due to Reaganomics, Ron. Prior to Reagan's "trickle-down economics," there was much less wealth dispari in the US than there is today, 40 years later.Straw man argument.... there are more millionaires in the US now vs 1980 (500000 in 1980 and 18.6 million in 2020) 80 percent of people who have made a million or more are self made. I am so sick of this argument because it is predicated on the pie only being so big, when in reality
the just keeps getting bigger. Now let's get to the point, all the cry babies out there who think they are being screwed by the rich are just unmotivated to work at making themselves rich.
On 07-23-21 08:20, Jeff Thiele <=-
spoke to Ron Lauzon about Re: Political momentum <=-
In the Leftie world, they **believe** that most wealth will trickle
down, but reality (as shown in EVERY socialist country) is that little wealth will actually trickle down and the Elites will keep most of it.
That's exactly where we are today due to Reaganomics, Ron. Prior to Reagan's "trickle-down economics," there was much less wealth disparity
in the US than there is today, 40 years later.
Just who do you think that those "elites" who keep most of the wealth?
Are they Democrats or Republicans?
Mike Powell wrote to JEFF THIELE <=-
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of it?
Immediately before, I think it was called stagflation.
Jeff Squires wrote to Jeff Thiele <=-
Don't need to, I know exactly what it is. Government stays out of the
way of business ie: high taxes and red tape and business make money
that is in turn goes out into the economy.... Capitalism... Here's one
for you, what is the purpose of our government?
Jeff Squires wrote to Jeff Thiele <=-
reality the just keeps getting bigger. Now let's get to the point, all
the cry babies out there who think they are being screwed by the rich
are just unmotivated to work at making themselves rich.
Mike Powell wrote to DALE SHIPP <=-
Many of the highest-profile wealthy people in this country, although I cannot say for certain how they are registered, seem to come out in support of non-Republican candidates and policies.
Um, no. "Trickle-down economics," or "voodoo economics" as the elder Bush
called it, was introduced by Reagan. I suggest you do a little research
on that.
Don't need to, I know exactly what it is.
Government stays out of the way of business ie: high taxes and red tape and
business make money that is in turn goes out into the economy.... Capitalism...
Here's one for you, what is the purpose of our government?
The Truth is out there ...
And you are WAY out there....
Don't need to, I know exactly what it is. Government stays out of the way of business ie: high taxes and red tape and business make money that is in turn goes out into the economy.... Capitalism... Here's on for you, what is the purpose of our government?Jeff can't answer that, even though it clearly states it in the Constitution.
He can't answer it because it goes against the Narrative.
reality the just keeps getting bigger. Now let's get to the point, al the cry babies out there who think they are being screwed by the rich are just unmotivated to work at making themselves rich.Bingo!
That's why we call these morons the "Elites". They want to believe that they are so important that everyone else should support them while they continue to spew out their nonesense.
On 07-23-21 18:28, Jeff Thiele <=-
spoke to Jeff Squires about Re: Political momentum <=-
2020 dollars aren't worth what 1980 dollars were.
1980 millionaires are today's billionaires.
The fact is that the wealth discrepancy
between the richest and the poorest (not to mention the average) has increased dramatically.
All that "trickle-down" economics has done is funnel money upwards. How do you suppose our country got along prior to Reagan's introduction of it?
Immediately before, I think it was called stagflation.
Ya, and wasn't that created by Jimmy Carter? A Democrat? The worst President >in history - until Biden came along.
Many of the highest-profile wealthy people in this country, although I cannot say for certain how they are registered, seem to come out in support of non-Republican candidates and policies.
Those people are the #2 group of Lefties: The Elites.
They are used by group #1 (The Power Hungry) to fund/support their efforts to control everything.
The Elites just think that they can run things better than everyone else.
Don't need to, I know exactly what it is. Government stays out of the
way of business ie: high taxes and red tape and business make money
that is in turn goes out into the economy.... Capitalism... Here's one
for you, what is the purpose of our government?
Jeff can't answer that, even though it clearly states it in the Constitution.
He can't answer it because it goes against the Narrative.
Mike Powell wrote to RON LAUZON <=-
They may be good at running their own companies but I am not certain
that makes them qualified to run the government, especially if they are doing so without being elected.
You don't know Jack Squat.
Really? The best form of government is no government at all?
Kind of like a sheriff with no guns, allowing robbers to run off
with all the loot ...
Read the fucking preamble to the US Constitution.
No, a government that does what it's Constitution instructs it to do and no more.
You don't know Jack Squat.
Quoting Jeff Squires to Lee Lofaso <=-
You didn't answer my question....
They may be good at running their own companies but I am not certain that makes them qualified to run the government, especially if they are doing so without being elected.
I would argue that they would be better than politicians since they are more grounded in reality.
Remember that most businessmen have some sort of accounting to people. If the
shareholders are mad, CEOs get fired. If the customers are mad, the company goes bankrupt (or bought out). Either way, the head of the company is gone.
Businessmen tend to create what people want.
Politicians tend to create what they want, or what they THINK people want.
Quoting Mike Powell to Ron Lauzon <=-
I used to believe this also until working in a government job under
some of them. They seem good at some things but not at keeping the interest of the public, or taxpayers, in mind.
Some of them were not so successful at business, either.
The key phrase in what I said to Jeff(?) there is "doing so without
being elected." IMHO, that group is driven solely by their politics
and are not in tune with the public interest as a whole. They use
their money and influence to get what is best for them.
Successful businessmen do most of these things. Most successful businessmen are smart enough not to become politicians. :)
The key phrase in what I said to Jeff(?) there is "doing so without being elected." IMHO, that group is driven solely by their politics and are not in tune with the public interest as a whole. They use their money and influence to get what is best for them.And I think you've hit it. Part of the problem is that over the
decades, we've created a 4th branch of gov't: the Bureaucracy. They are not elected, fireproof and completely unaccountable. And the
legislature has illegally ceded authority to them for many things.
Is that so, Mr. Constitutional Expert?
Is that so, Mr. Constitutional Expert?Never said I was but I realize now you think you know it all so ce la vie...
On 28 Jul 2021, Jeff Squires said the following...
Is that so, Mr. Constitutional Expert?Never said I was but I realize now you think you know it all so ce la vie...
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that the government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do, you probably oug ht to make sure that's what the Constitution actually says.
I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone can pull
it up and read it.
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that the government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do, yo probably oug ht to make sure that's what the Constitution actually sa I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone can pul it up and read it.Yes, that is true anyone can, the trouble is when people from the left read those words, they can become slanted and skewed, it is necessary at this point to re-read those words or have a explanation provided minus
the liberal slant. Conservatives do have a greater ability to understand those words as originally intended simply because we are not liberal.
Why is because we have no desire to use them for something that was
never intended in the first place.
Yes, that is true anyone can, the trouble is when people from the left read those words, they can become slanted and skewed, it is necessary at this point to re-read those words or have a explanation provided minus
the liberal slant. Conservatives do have a greater ability to understand those words as originally intended simply because we are not liberal.
Why is because we have no desire to use them for something that was
never intended in the first place.
Quoting Gregory Deyss to Jeff Thiele <=-
Yes, that is true anyone can, the trouble is when people from the left read those words, they can become slanted and skewed, it is necessary
at this point to re-read those words or have a explanation provided
minus the liberal slant. Conservatives do have a greater ability to understand those words as originally intended simply because we are not liberal. Why is because we have no desire to use them for something
that was never intended in the first place.
Lefties don't believe that truth can be objective. So everything they read/see/etc. is always skewed by how they feel.
That's one of the reasons they are impervious to any fact that goes counter to their false Narrative. They don't like the fact, so it gets ignored.
They've stated time and time again (even back to FDR) that the Constitution is a "living document", meaning that they will interpret it however they want to get what they want. But the undertone of that idea is "we are the rulers and we are seizing power".
I assume by "over the decades," Ron means "in the Constitution," since the >Constitution clearly allows the executive branch to appoint officials, >subject to approval and consent by Congress, and Congress may at their >discretion allow the president, courts, and "Departments" to appoint "inferior >Officers" on their own.
But surely you knew that.
But in the Bureaucracy, they have no such concern. So their motivations
are not in sync with the country.
Successful businessmen do most of these things. Most successful businessmen are smart enough not to become politicians. :)
Based on what we've seen from the last couple of years, some successful businessmen are de-facto politicians but not elected by the public.
* Slavery really happened and was bad
I assume by "over the decades," Ron means "in the Constitution," since th >Constitution clearly allows the executive branch to appoint officials, >subject to approval and consent by Congress, and Congress may at their >discretion allow the president, courts, and "Departments" to appoint "inf >Officers" on their own.Yes, I don't always agree with how they do it, though. On a state level,
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that the government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do, you probably ought to make sure that's what the Constitution actually says.
I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone can pull
it up and read it.
I have never heard anyone credible say it did not happen and was not
bad. It is also something that ended over 155 years ago, and that Americans alive today had nothing to do with. So I am not real sure why *some* Americans are always bringing slavery up as if it ended just last year.
Well, other than the fact that it can be used to continue to keep us divided. I don't think that is a good reason, but don't doubt that not everyone agrees.
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that the government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do, yo probably ought to make sure that's what the Constitution actually say I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone can pul it up and read it.I never said the government CAN only do what the Constitution instructs,
I said it "Should", a big difference. You right, a lot more people
should read the Constitution.
Quoting Mike Powell to Ron Lauzon <=-
I have met some people like that in government, that don't really care
and don't seem concerned about wasting money. I have met several that also take their jobs very seriously and do what they can to be as efficient as possible.
Yes. The ones I was talking about are not even appointed or serving
as a public servant. They are just there to cover the talking points
with their twitter followers and hanger-ons, or put their money behind projects that might not be in our interests.
Quoting Jeff Squires to Jeff Thiele <=-
I never said the government CAN only do what the Constitution
instructs, I said it "Should", a big difference. You right, a lot more people should read the Constitution.
In a normal company, the good people get promoted and encouraged, while
the bad people get sidelined, fired, or layed off.
But in the gov't, they stay until they die. Did you know that in the Bureaucracy, they are more likely to die than quit their job?
Yes. The ones I was talking about are not even appointed or serving
as a public servant. They are just there to cover the talking points with their twitter followers and hanger-ons, or put their money behind projects that might not be in our interests.
One of the problem that I saw in some big companies is that management would create "experts" who had the credentials for the title (but really no knowledge or experience). Management would then use these people - who
would always do what management tells them to - to "vet" decisions that management was not allow to make (ex: what computer systems to use).
Not to mention the Left's insistance that having a degree is something
like Philosophy automatically makes them smart enough to plan an
economy.
I have never heard anyone credible say it did not happen and was not bad. It is also something that ended over 155 years ago, and that Americans alive today had nothing to do with. So I am not real sure why *some* Americans are always bringing slavery up as if it ended just last year.
Apparently, people in the former confederacy states haven't gotten
that memo.
But the real issue is the enduring impacts of that, and of the loss
on the part of the confederate traitors, and the policies they put in
place to prevent their former slaves from achieving equality in our
society. The descendants of those traitors tried to keep the
descendants of slaves from, say, buying property in the same
neighborhood that they live in. And while it may be true that there
is no one living today who was ever a slave, there are certainly people
alive today who's, say, grandparents were born into slavery, and many
more people who were not permitted to use the same water fountain or
eat at the same lunch counter as white people.
And which political party was it that worked to institute these policies? They were not called "DixieCRATS" for nothing.
As I am sure you will point out, "Today's Democrat party is not the same party as the one that did those things." You might be right, but it is part of their past, just like slavery is a part of the past, so it must
be OK to point that out at every possible opportunity, right?
* Slavery really happened and was bad
I have never heard anyone credible say it did not happen and was not bad. It
is also something that ended over 155 years ago,
and that Americans alive today had nothing to do with.
So I am not real sure why *some* Americans are
always bringing slavery up as if it ended just last year.
Well, other than the fact that it can be used to continue to keep us divided.
I don't think that is a good reason,
but don't doubt that not everyone agrees.
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that the
government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do, you
probably ought to make sure that's what the Constitution actually says.
I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone can pull
it up and read it.
I never said the government CAN only do what the Constitution instructs, I said it "Should", a big difference. You right, a lot more people should read the Constitution.
Is that so, Mr. Constitutional Expert?
ce laNever said I was but I realize now you think you know it all so
vie...
I never said I was either, but if you're going to claim that theyou
government can only do what the Constitution "instructs" it to do,
probably oug ht to make sure that's what the Constitution actuallysays.
I mean, come on. It's not like it's a secret document. Anyone canpull
it up and read it.
Yes, that is true anyone can, the trouble is when people from the left read
those words, they can become slanted and skewed, it is necessary at this point to re-read those words or have a explanation provided minus the liberal
slant. Conservatives do have a greater ability to understand those words as
originally intended simply because we are not liberal. Why is because we have
no desire to use them for something that was never intended in the first place.
Is that so? Were the people who wrote those words not the liberals of their
day, themselves? How can you be so absolutely certain that your reading is the correct one, and that you are not the one distorting the words?
Why is because we have no desire to use them for something that was
never intended in the first place.
How do you know what was and was not intended? The Constitution allows for Congress to make laws and even has a process for itself to be amended.
Do you think that the right to bear arms was intended when the Constitution
was originally written?
They've stated time and time again (even back to FDR) that the Constitution is a "living document", meaning that they will interpret it however they want to get what they want. But the undertone of that idea is "we are the rulers and we are seizing power".
Do you think that the right to bear arms was intended when the ConstitutionThe right to own slaves certainly was.
was originally written?
"Ask not what you can do for your country, but what this country
can do for you." ~ Trumper's version of JFK quote
As I am sure you will point out, "Today's Democrat party is not the same party as the one that did those things." You might be right, but it is part of their past, just like slavery is a part of the past, so it must
be OK to point that out at every possible opportunity, right?
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