Hello Maurice!

No one seems to be interested in building a new offline packet
system.

I've known that for decades now which is why I built my
own without ANY abandoware and/or obsolete protocols.
That is the main reason I can claim to be the best there
is, and ever was, in all of fidonet, present and past.
The future? I don't expect to live forever.

I am not sure what you've built. You are still connecting with
a host system with binkp, and fetching .PKT files, right?

And then you are doing something with those .PKT files and
storing them in JAM format or something other?
--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

You are still connecting with a host system with binkp, and fetching
.PKT files, right?

Uncompressed .PKT files in order to avoid zip and other such corruption. At present, and past for that matter, this fidonet node has been using binkd for transfers to host nodes out there it requires connecting with.

And then you are doing something with those .PKT files and storing
them in JAM format or something other?

You have the basic idea. However the format is not PKT as all of that is stripped out considering it is utter crap. Same with the first 14 bytes of packed msg's which are also given ye olde heave-ho. Basically it is a stored msg format without any binary data to get in the way of progress. It is 100%, unadultered printable text with a few ascii control codes to facillitate all sorts of compatibilty you can ever dream up, including QWK if that is actually a desirable option, which of course it isn't.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

o- -o o- o- o- o- o- -o -o -o o- o-
/) (\ /) /) /) /) /) (\ (\ (\ /) /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Soþ hit sylf acyþeð.
Truth will make itself known.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

It is 100%, unadultered printable text with a few ascii
control codes to facillitate all sorts of compatibilty you
can ever dream up, including QWK if that is actually a
desirable option, which of course it isn't.

So.. what does the UI for messaginglook like?


--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

So.. what does the UI for messaginglook like?

Not much. For reading I just output to the linux terminal using regular gnu text applications such as 'cat' and 'less' and the such. For posting I am using vim. I was going to do something with ncurses not unlike msged and/or golded but as of yet haven't gotten around to it.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o -o o- o- o- -o o- o- o- o-
(\ (\ (\ (\ /) /) /) (\ /) /) /) /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Ne beo þu no to tælende, ne to tweospræce.
Do not be too quick to disparage, nor too double-tongued.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice Kinal!

** On Saturday 27.12.25 - 00:02, Maurice Kinal wrote to August Abolins:

Hey August!

So.. what does the UI for messaginglook like?

Not much. For reading I just output to the linux terminal
using regular gnu text applications such as 'cat' and
'less' and the such. For posting I am using vim. I was
going to do something with ncurses not unlike msged and/or
golded but as of yet haven't gotten around to it.

So, basically you list your messages with ls? Are the message
files renamed with subj/from-to/date/subject so that you can
see what they are quickly?

And I suppose you can't display msgid-relationships for
navigating a thread?

References of "which is why I built my own.."
755 26.12.25 Maurice Kinal Are QWK packets still the
+ 973 26.12.25 ÀÄÄAugust Abolins
799 26.12.25 ÀÄÄMaurice Kinal
+ 699 26.12.25 ÀÄÄAugust Abolins which is why I built my own..
1365 26.12.25 ÀÄÄMaurice Kinal
+ 371 26.12.25 ÀÄÄAugust Abolins

805 27.12.25 ÀÄÄMaurice Kinal

+! 788 26.12.25 ÀÄÄAugust Abolins




--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

So, basically you list your messages with ls?

As of this writing, all incoming is dumped into a single file with individual msgs occupying a line. Thus "wc -l" incoming.file will yeild the number of msgs in the file.

Each msg (line) contains five fields; $DateTime\0$To\0$From\0$Subject\0\$Body\n

And I suppose you can't display msgid-relationships for navigating a
thread?

Yes. kludges are part of $Body and are easily be 'grep'ped from that field. They stick out like a sore thumb given the leading '\1' character. However I could easily be convinced to putting kludges into their own field.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

o- -o o- -o -o -o o- o- -o o- o- -o
/) (\ /) (\ (\ (\ /) /) (\ /) /) (\
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Se cræft þæs lareowdomes bið cræft ealra cræfta.
The art of teaching is the art of all arts.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

** On Saturday 27.12.25 - 01:04, you wrote:

So, basically you list your messages with ls?

As of this writing, all incoming is dumped into a single
file with individual msgs occupying a line. Thus "wc -l"
incoming.file will yeild the number of msgs in the file.

Each msg (line) contains five fields; $DateTime\0$To\0$From\0$Subject\0\$Body\n

One line per message.. sounds very efficient. +1

And I suppose you can't display msgid-relationships for navigating a
thread?

Yes. kludges are part of $Body and are easily be
'grep'ped from that field. They stick out like a sore
thumb given the leading '\1' character. However I could
easily be convinced to putting kludges into their own
field.

You'd need extra logic to produce a FULL list of threaded/
connected messages. But two at a time isn't too bad.

You should produce a vid illustrating how you do typical reading/searching/replying activities.

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

One line per message.. sounds very efficient.

For sure. Faster processing as well.

You'd need extra logic to produce a FULL list of threaded/ connected messages.

Like the output of unix-tree?

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o -o o- -o o- o- -o -o o- -o
(\ (\ (\ (\ /) (\ /) /) (\ (\ /) (\
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Ich habe Eichhörnchen in meiner Hose!
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

** On Saturday 27.12.25 - 17:59, you wrote:

You'd need extra logic to produce a FULL list of threaded/
connected messages.

Like the output of unix-tree?

Sounds like your "system" is just a collection of various unix
commands at the cmd-line. How do you mark a message for a
reply later?

Take a look at OpenXP and give it a spin! It's available for
linux as well.


--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

Sounds like your "system" is just a collection of various unix
commands at the cmd-line.

Change cmd-line to bash script and you have it. Also a few additional function files to facillitate the filteration issues. I'd probably do a QWK <-> MSG that way if QWK was a desirable format, which of course it isn't.

How do you mark a message for a reply later?

Use the line number of the msg and use that in a reply vector and then once editted write it to a formatted reply file that can be uploaded to the mothership, "Little Mikey's Brain" in this case. If you see this reply then you have confirmation that it works.

Take a look at OpenXP and give it a spin!

Sure. However if it cannot handle utf-8 msg posting then it won't get very far here.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o -o -o -o -o -o o- o- -o o-
(\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ /) /) (\ /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Se forholena cræft and forhyded gold ne bið ællunga ungelice.
Concealed skill and hidden gold are not entirely unalike.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

On 28 Dec. 2025 01:19, you wrote to August:

Hey August!

Take a look at OpenXP and give it a spin!

Sure. However if it cannot handle utf-8 msg posting then it won't get very far here.

Utf-8 chars seem to "want" to work in the nntp groups, but in my case the limitation is the font set, and DOS terminal in Windows . Maybe the Linux version doesnt have that char restriction.

--- AfterShock/Android 1.7.5
* Origin: Mobile Pixel 3aXL (2:221/1.59)

Hey August!

On Sun, 28 Dec 2025 08:13:42 -0500, you wrote:

Utf-8 chars seem to "want" to work in the nntp groups, but in my case
the limitation is the font set, and DOS terminal in Windows . Maybe the Linux version doesnt have that char restriction.

If you're still referring to OpenXP here, I'm not sure if there has been any more development lately or not (or if there ever will be), but last time I checked, the Linux version still didn't support utf-8.

Winpoint did a little bit better, but still wasn't 100%, and well, it's Windows only, so that's already a huge limitation. I had mentioned a bug in how it handles time and UTC offsets upwards of 1-2 (or more, time flies these days) years ago, got a reply that it would be looked into, and nothing ever came of it.

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hello Nick!

** On Sunday 28.12.25 - 08:11, you wrote:

If you're still referring to OpenXP here, I'm not sure if
there has been any more development lately or not (or if
there ever will be), but last time I checked, the Linux
version still didn't support utf-8.

The latest one seems to be Feb 2025:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/openxp5/files/OpenXP%205.0/

Winpoint did a little bit better, but still wasn't 100%,
and well, it's Windows only, so that's already a huge
limitation.

It thought Win-anything was going to be my final approach to
this messaging hobby, but I actually grew quite fond of the
text-based OpenXP.

I had mentioned a bug in how it handles time and UTC
offsets upwards of 1-2 (or more, time flies these days)
years ago, got a reply that it would be looked into, and
nothing ever came of it.

I recall something re a time issue. But was there an
acknowledgement? ..or just an excuse?

What's the big deal with UTF-8 in FTN anyway? Do we need utf-8
emojiis in these messages?

As-is, my font [Lucinda console] & charset supports French,
Spanish, Norwegian, and few others.
--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

in my case the limitation is the font set, and DOS terminal

Right. In my case I am using latarcyrheb-sun32 which is supplied by the kbd-2.9.0 package (/usr/share/consolefonts). It looks great on a 4K monitor on the bash shell as well as within vim. Back in the old days there was vga fonts that could be used in a DOS terminal but that was only supporting 8-bit character sets such as cp437. As for editors I thought the vim port of windows had no issues with utf-8. Near as I can tell it is abandonware that is holding Windows users back wrt utf-8.

Maybe the Linux version doesnt have that char restriction.

I don't know since I cannot find the source. I did find the latest linux port but it is out of sync with the current ncurses version deployed here. So far I am finding that the "open" part of openxp to be highly questionable given this obvious handicap.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o -o -o o- -o o- -o o- o- o-
(\ (\ (\ (\ (\ /) (\ /) (\ /) /) /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Heald hordlocan, hyge fæste bind mid modsefan.
Hold close the treasure-chest, bind your thoughts fast within the heart. --- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hey Nick!

it's Windows only, so that's already a huge limitation

For sure.

got a reply that it would be looked into, and nothing ever came of it

Sounds to me like abandonware.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o o- -o o- o- o- o- o- o- -o o- o-
(\ /) (\ /) /) /) /) /) /) (\ /) /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Help, help, I'm being repressed!
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

Maybe the Linux version doesnt have that char restriction.

I don't know since I cannot find the source. I did find
the latest linux port but it is out of sync with the
current ncurses version deployed here. So far I am
finding that the "open" part of openxp to be highly
questionable given this obvious handicap.

The sourecode isn't at SourceForge?

Isn't this it:

https://sourceforge.net/p/openxp5/code/HEAD/tree/

???


--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello Maurice!

Sounds to me like abandonware.

The last update contribution seems to be on 2025-08-29
actually. Hardly abandonware.

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

https://sourceforge.net/p/openxp5/code/HEAD/tree/

Yes. However that is pascal source and currently I don't have a pascal compiler. As of this writing I am unconvinced this is worth the hassel but I'll give it some further thought before going any further with openxp.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o o- -o -o -o -o -o -o -o -o
(\ (\ (\ /) (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Sprec ofter embe oðres monnes weldæde þonne emb ðine agna.
Speak more often about other people's good deeds than about your own.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

https://sourceforge.net/p/openxp5/code/HEAD/tree/

Yes. However that is pascal source and currently I don't
have a pascal compiler. As of this writing I am
unconvinced this is worth the hassel but I'll give it some
further thought before going any further with openxp.

Looking inside my openxp.exe, it looks like Borland was used
for the Win version. GNU Pascal won't work for a linux
version?




--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

On Sun, 28 Dec 2025 11:58:00 -0500, you wrote:

I recall something re a time issue. But was there an
acknowledgement? ..or just an excuse?

Both, I suppose. First it was argued that I was wrong. After I showed screenshots as well as what time it actually was on my system, it was looked into a bit further, acknowledged, and then I never heard about it again. *shrug*

What's the big deal with UTF-8 in FTN anyway? Do we need utf-8
emojiis in these messages?

Nothing, really. It's just another advancement in the hobby that could benefit others (but doesn't have to), much like ipv6.

As-is, my font [Lucinda console] & charset supports French,
Spanish, Norwegian, and few others.

Whatever works for you, of course!

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hey August!

On Sun, 28 Dec 2025 12:45:00 -0500, you wrote:

The last update contribution seems to be on 2025-08-29
actually. Hardly abandonware.

--- OpenXP 5.0.64

The last commit on that date was this (translated):

- Fixed small display issue with UTF8 encoded messages

However, if you would want to see that fix in action, you would have to compile it yourself as it's not included in the "latest release" of 5.0.64.

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hi Nick...

Hey August!
On Sun, 28 Dec 2025 12:45:00 -0500, you wrote:

The last update contribution seems to be on 2025-08-29
actually. Hardly abandonware.
--- OpenXP 5.0.64

The last commit on that date was this (translated):
- Fixed small display issue with UTF8 encoded messages
However, if you would want to see that fix in action, you would have to compile it yourself as it's not included in the "latest release" of 5.0.64.
Regards,
Nick
... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.

i'm having a friend look into that, and do a fresh compilation, and hopefully address the latest ncurses issue.

--
/|ug
https://t.me/aabolins

--- Want fido for iOS/MacOS/Android/Win/Linux? https://shrtco.de/tpJ9yV
* Origin: Fido by Telegram BBS from Stas Mishchenkov (2:460/256)

Hey August!

GNU Pascal won't work for a linux version?

I didn't know there is/was a GNU Pascal!?!?! At the moment I am considering free pascal (www.freepascal.org) which appears to be the best supported pascal compiler for linux as we speak. My hesitation is centered around the ncurses version issue which probably will require some hacking. I've never hacked with a pascal compiler before.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

o- -o -o o- o- o- o- -o o- -o o- -o
/) (\ (\ /) /) /) /) (\ /) (\ /) (\
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Ræd sceal mon secgan, rune writan, leoþ gesingan, lofes gearnian.
One should give counsel, write secrets, sing songs, earn praise.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

GNU Pascal won't work for a linux version?

I didn't know there is/was a GNU Pascal!?!?! At the
moment I am considering free pascal (www.freepascal.org)
which appears to be the best supported pascal compiler for
linux as we speak. My hesitation is centered around the
ncurses version issue which probably will require some
hacking. I've never hacked with a pascal compiler before.

I see a file called ncurses.pas in the source package.

Not sure what an "updated" version needs to look like.

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hello Maurice!

GNU Pascal won't work for a linux version?

[...] At the moment I am considering free pascal
(www.freepascal.org) which appears to be the best
supported pascal compiler for linux as we speak. My
hesitation is centered around the ncurses version issue
which probably will require some hacking. I've never
hacked with a pascal compiler before.

It *does* seem to be geared or fpc.

BTW.. look at this dir: openxp5-code-r787\xplib

In it are .pas files for unicode and charsets. There are UTF-8
references in the code too. Maybe new UTF-8 "files" can be
added?

There is an ncurses.pas file too. Dunno if that's what you need
to "update".

--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

It *does* seem to be geared or fpc.

Errrr ... yeah.

BTW.. look at this dir: openxp5-code-r787\xplib

Will do but first and foremost it needs a working x86_64 based pascal compiler. Without that we're just guessing.

There is an ncurses.pas file too. Dunno if that's what you need to
"update".

A working pascal compiler. I'll give freepascal a go on a spare developmnet partition that sits unused since I am waiting for the newest glibc which is due for release soon. This way if I decide to bail on pascal it won't take much to get rid of. From my current understanding the build process is much like building JDK (Java Deveelopment Kit) and requires an already working freepascal compiler installed first. Myself I ditched java decades ago without any regrets. Pascal might turn out to be the same.

Care to place any bets on it's surviverability?

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o -o -o -o -o -o -o o- o- o- -o o-
(\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ (\ /) /) /) (\ /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Man deþ swa he byþ þonne he mot swa he wile.
A man acts what he is when he may do what he will.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice!

** On Saturday 27.12.25 - 00:02, you wrote:

[...] For reading I just output to the linux terminal
using regular gnu text applications such as 'cat' and
'less' and the such. For posting I am using vim. I was
going to do something with ncurses not unlike msged and/or
golded but as of yet haven't gotten around to it.

BTW..

You can define an external editor you want in OpenXP:

"The built-in editor can only do code page 437, so not much
more than that ASCII. You can find a UTF8 capable editor in Config/Options/Editor configure and ensure correct display in
the Crosspoint DOS window Set "Consolas" as the character set."


--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: (2:221/1.58)

Hey August!

You can define an external editor you want in OpenXP:

Same situation with both msged and golded. In their favour is that the source is c (msged) or c++ (golded). Last I checked they both worked with whatever gcc/g++ version I was using at the time.

However despite the above, I still prefer my modified MSG format which can handle many, many, many differing 8-bit codepages such as the IBM ones, cp437 and cp866 being the most popular, neevermind pure utf-8. Neither squish nor jam based editors, can compete as far as I am concerned and therefore no attraction for another application especially one that requires an additional compiler.

Also, I actually use vim in my day-to-day text editting so I can always count on it to be part and parcel of any build I have done over the past 30 years or so.

Дуже груви,
Maurice

-o o- -o -o -o -o o- -o -o o- -o o-
(\ /) (\ (\ (\ (\ /) (\ (\ /) (\ /)
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
... Gif ðu wille godne hlisan habban, ne fægna ðu nanes yfeles.
If you want to have a good reputation, don't rejoice in any evil.
--- GNU bash, version 5.3.9(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)