From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <bbaugh-A7FD22.16432023072003@enews.newsguy.com>,
Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@mac.com> wrote:

In article <timmcn-37DCE1.20190322072003@gemini.visi.com>,
Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote:

Very few home users have
any need or desire to have different user accounts.

Are there actual data about what fraction of home uses consist of a
single person and what fraction includes relatives, housemates, and the like?

It would need to be surveyed differently. I'm a single home user, but I
have (and use) four user accounts on my PB - an "Administrator" account,
which is rarely ever used but is there just in case; my personal
account; one for my girlfriend; and a guest account for friends to use.

Guess I'm one of the "very few", eh? And note how obscure my
requirements are. ;)

KeS
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <m7m3v-cuc.ln1@pursued-with.net>, Kevin Stevens <Kevin_Stevens@Hotmail.com> wrote:

In article <bbaugh-A7FD22.16432023072003@enews.newsguy.com>,
Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@mac.com> wrote:

In article <timmcn-37DCE1.20190322072003@gemini.visi.com>,
Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote:

Very few home users have
any need or desire to have different user accounts.

Are there actual data about what fraction of home uses consist of a
single person and what fraction includes relatives, housemates, and the like?

It would need to be surveyed differently. I'm a single home user, but I have (and use) four user accounts on my PB - an "Administrator" account, which is rarely ever used but is there just in case; my personal
account; one for my girlfriend; and a guest account for friends to use.

Guess I'm one of the "very few", eh? And note how obscure my
requirements are. ;)

Also an individual home user.

1) An Admin account, used when installing software, including updates.
2) My normal account
3) A "clean" account for troubleshooting such things as corrupt pref
files when some application starts acting "wonky."
4) A "Visitor" account for my friends and others to use when they visit.

--
Spenser
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Okay, now I'll answer the answer to the original post. :-)

In article <mr-3D4B96.11141223072003@news.fu-berlin.de>, Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:

In article <none-2CCFA1.16084222072003@corp.supernews.com>,
McTech <none@nospam.com> wrote:

I will adress your post by answering your points only where you have a valid complaint. Otherwise, I will use these:

S = Subjective, i.e. not something Apple has done wrong, per se.
CM = Closed mind, unwillingness to accept new ways to handle the same thing. I = Individual, i.e. something that might affect you if you have poor
eyesight.
P = Addressed in Panther

The whole screen is blurry [make anti-aliasing an option]

I

Text is blurry [make text anti-alising an option and bring back hand
tuned bit-mapped fonts]

I

I love anti-aliasing myself, but he's not the only one disliking it. I
guess an easy way to turn it off wouldn't be a bad thing.

The dock has a horrible interface, it's too big, it does too many
things, the icons are indistinguisable (sp?) from one another, it's in a (small list of) locked position(s), it's controlled by plists or some other voodoo, you can't turn it off [bring back a fully configuarble
Apple Menu controlled by aliases/files/folders]

S

I've grown to really enjoy using the Dock. The only thing I'd like to
see is a bit more customization, like being able to add my own
separator lines.

I guess there's also a problem for people who put a lot of files and
folders in the Dock, because they can all look alike and you have to
drag the mouse on top of each one to display its name. It's a problem
that's been raised as early as the public beta of OS X, but I don't see
a way to address it.

There is no widow shading, while many people don't like it I find it
very useful, the minimize to dock is less useful [bring back window shading]

S

This is indeed subjective, but there's really no reason why both
couldn't be included. Double-clicking on the window's title bar could
minimize the window (as it does now), while holding down a modifier key
(like the control key) while double-clicking it could trigger window
shade.

However, this is all possible with the relatively inexpensive
WindowShade X.

The whole "candy coated interface" is ugly. [allow (and I mean
officially allow, fully supported, and that means in Apple's own apps
too) theme support]

S

This is indeed very subjective (I generally like Aqua, except for a few things). Also, I think that one of the reasons why Apple stopped short
of supporting themes is because they are prone to conflicts and it
would have been difficult for Apple to properly support them, which is
a very valid reason.

The menues are hard to read [get rid of the transarency and the
horizontal lined background]

P

I didn't think they were hard to read in Jaguar (less transparency than
in 10.1). I rather liked their appearance and I'm kind of sad to learn
that they'll change in Panther.

The text used for Filenames is ugly, too big, hard to read [allow user choice of fonts and display the font on a flat white (user colour
choice) rectangle]

P

It's hard to identify active/inactive windows [see themes above]

I

I've always thought it was a little difficult also. Maybe it would help
if the text inside a window would also become a little grayed out?

Windows have an indistinct edge [see thems above]

Have you turned off the shadows? If you haven't, he window edges are very clear.

Even with shadows on, if a window is on top of a dark area (e.g. a
window on top of a browser window that has a black background), you
can't see the shadows and lose the 3-D effect. The windows in OS 8 and
9 had a somewhat more 3-D border that helped in situations like these.

You can't move windows by their edges [allow it]

P, to some extent.

I didn't really use to drag windows by their edges too often myself, so
I don't really miss it, but this feature should never have disappeared
in the first place.

Double headed arrows in the scroll bars only at one end [option for
double headed arrows at both ends]

S

This is easily fixed by using one of the many shareware/freeware apps.
However, I don't think it would kill Apple to include this "hidden"
option along with the 2 others in the General preferences. I understand
they want to keep things simple, but I think most users would be
sophisticated enough to deal with this 3rd option. :-)

Windows/desktop don't update well [make the file system live -- this
would be difficult to do under UNIX]

They update well for me.

They don't update well here (at least not all the time). For example,
drag a URL or a text clipping from a browser window to the desktop and
most of the time you don't see it appear on the desktop unless you
switch to the Finder.

However... it wasn't any better under OS 9. This is actually something
that has bothered me for quite a long time. Maybe there are valid
technical reasons why this can't be done.

The same foler can be displayed in two windows at the same time [prevent this from happening]

CM

Yes,I don't see what's wrong with that either.

The button bar in finder windows is a pain [option to permanently
disable it]

CM

I've found that the button bar can be really useful. Still, I guess it
wouldn't hurt to have an option to permanently disable it. Maybe option-clicking on a window's toolbar button could collapse the toolbar
of all open windows? That would be consistent with option-clicking a
window's close button.

Icon spacing is huge (required due to the big-assed ugly font used for filenames) [option to set it as desired]

This is due to 256 char long filenames and 128x128 icons. But I agree that it
would follow the size of the icons choosen.

Command dragging a file to align it to a grid is a pain because command clicking a selected file deselects it on mouse down [the selection/deselection should happen on mouse-up]

S

I don't think this is subjective. I've also found it to be a pain in
the butt. There should be different combinations of modifier keys for
those actions.

The OS forgets where icons are supposed to be [fix it]

My OS don't do that...?

Mine either.

The multi-user security crap is a pain in the ass -- I was setting up an app on a users computer and it wouldn't work for him but would work for me, turns out it was just a file permissions issue and didn't take too long to fix, but it's a pain [option to disable the multi-user state,
and file permissions]

CM

I've gotten used to the multi-user setup of OS X, but permissions can
certainly be a pain. I can certainly understand why it would be easier
for many people to have a single-user system

File permissions keep getting screwed up and need to be repaired [fix
the damn bug]

There is no such need, per se. Apple has set a fixed set of permissions, and some installers mess with these. But unless you have a rouge installer, it never causes any problems.

You have to keep typing in your password for crap all the time (like chaging the date, or installing an app) [allow single user mode with
none of that crap]

CM

I don't see why this is close-minded. It is a pain in the butt to use
many OS X installers compared to OS 9. I'm a little sick of having to
type in my password.

File types and creator codes are being ignored -- file name extensiosn
are required [force apps to use file types and creator codes, leave filenames to the user's descression (sp?)]

Type/creator is not being ignored.

Apps can't be found if they aren't in the right "magic locations" [bring back the desktop database]

Examples? The only time I've seen anything remotely related to this are some updaters from Apple that updates, for example, iCal in /Applicaions/iCal even
if iCal isn't there. This has been fixed in the latest updaters released from
Apple (Safari, for example, updates Safari no mater where it is).

There are some Apple updaters that wouldn't update an application if
it's not in the "proper" folder. I don't seem to remember OS 9 updaters
not being able to update an application because it had been placed
somewhere else on the HD (but it's possible that my memory is failing
me).

I'll stop now, I'm getting tired of typing, this is not an complete list.

--
Martin Nadeau
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

You can't move windows by their edges [allow it]

P, to some extent.

I didn't really use to drag windows by their edges too often myself, so
I don't really miss it, but this feature should never have disappeared
in the first place.

Personally, one of the very few things I like
about Windoze is the ability to resize windows
by any edge. On Mac, once in a great while,
some idiot app gives me a window that can't
go any further up and left, but has the size
thingy off the screen the other way.

I don't see why this is close-minded. It is a pain in the butt to use
many OS X installers compared to OS 9. I'm a little sick of having to
type in my password.

I have no objection to typing the administrator's password
when I am not in the administrator's account. But since
I always log in as admin when I want to install something,
....

There are some Apple updaters that wouldn't update an application if
it's not in the "proper" folder. I don't seem to remember OS 9 updaters

Office X updater I have now complains that
Office X is in the wrong place. (I moved
it to another disk partition because it is
ABSURDLY huge. But I moved it back to
/Applications and the updater _still_ complains.

--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Alice Faber wrote:

resides, she created folders for each of her daughters, without creating separate log-on accounts for them. The idea of setting up separate
accounts for them would, I think, strike her as over-kill and

nice they're so well-behaved. :-)

On OS 9, not even breaking their favorite games
several times taught my two boys to stop "experimenting"
with control panels and extensions.

--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <michelle-229D52.20453623072003@news.west.cox.net>, Michelle
Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

It has delayed
pop up menus that are different depening on what the file is, etc.

It's context sensitive; that's great. The menus show me just what is appropriate.

Also, the Dock's popup menus don't have to be "delayed". Just press the
Control key first and they'll appear immediately.

Why isn't it simply a folder with a bunch of aliases in it? Why
can't I move something from it to the desktop?

Because that's not what it is for. Why can't you move an item from the Apple menu to the desktop?

Very true. Still, it would be rather nice if, when holding a modifier
key, dragging an icon to the desktop would actually move the real item.

The same foler can be displayed in two windows at the same time [prevent this from happening]

why? It can be useful.

It's a horrible design feature. You can have the same folder displayed
in two windws, get confused at what you're looking and and cause damage because you think you have two copies of something.

It's a very useful design feature. But one has to know what one is
doing.

In what situation is this useful though? Not that I'm doubting what
you're saying, but I'm just curious as to what use it can have.

The button bar in finder windows is a pain [option to permanently disable it]

It can be disabled by clicking the button in the top right of the window; it will stay disabled until that button is clicked again.

Sorry, it keeps coming back. If you know a way to turn it off
permanently, let me know then I can stop having to click the damn thing all the time.

As I said, I clicked on the button to turn off the window bar, and it
stayed turned off.

I think he means that if you close the window and then open it again,
the toolbar will be back on.

The spacing is too big, I want tighter spacing. The font is too big, I want to use 10 point Geneva.

What icon/size does it use now? It looks like 10 point Geneva to me.

By default, I believe it uses 12 point Lucida Grande.

--
Martin Nadeau
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <230720032215548701%nadeama@mac.com>,
Martin Nadeau <nadeama@mac.com> wrote:

Text is blurry [make text anti-alising an option and bring back hand tuned bit-mapped fonts]

I

I love anti-aliasing myself, but he's not the only one disliking it. I guess an easy way to turn it off wouldn't be a bad thing.

Frankly, all my screens are crystal clear, and text in 9pt are never, ever hard
for me to read. I just have a hard time understanding how people can have these
problems unless they have poor eyesight or a old monitor.

What Apple could do is have system-side settings for font -size-.

The dock has a horrible interface, it's too big, it does too many things, the icons are indistinguisable (sp?) from one another, it's in a (small list of) locked position(s), it's controlled by plists or some other voodoo, you can't turn it off [bring back a fully configuarble Apple Menu controlled by aliases/files/folders]

S

I've grown to really enjoy using the Dock. The only thing I'd like to see is a bit more customization, like being able to add my own separator lines.

I guess there's also a problem for people who put a lot of files and folders in the Dock, because they can all look alike and you have to drag the mouse on top of each one to display its name. It's a problem that's been raised as early as the public beta of OS X, but I don't see a way to address it.

The solution is dragging your ~/Library/Favorites folder to the dock after attaching a nice icon to it, and put aliases to all the files and folders you want in it.

It's hard to identify active/inactive windows [see themes above]

I

I've always thought it was a little difficult also. Maybe it would help if the text inside a window would also become a little grayed out?

It's an idea, of course, but it would be horrible for art people like myself if
inactive windows' colors where inaccurate.

Windows have an indistinct edge [see thems above]

Have you turned off the shadows? If you haven't, he window edges are very clear.

Even with shadows on, if a window is on top of a dark area (e.g. a window on top of a browser window that has a black background), you can't see the shadows and lose the 3-D effect. The windows in OS 8 and 9 had a somewhat more 3-D border that helped in situations like these.

Well, this would only be a problem if you have a window with an all-black content on top of another window with all-black content.

Double headed arrows in the scroll bars only at one end [option for double headed arrows at both ends]

S

This is easily fixed by using one of the many shareware/freeware apps. However, I don't think it would kill Apple to include this "hidden" option along with the 2 others in the General preferences. I understand they want to keep things simple, but I think most users would be sophisticated enough to deal with this 3rd option. :-)

Nah, I think Apple did it right, but left the backdoor open for 3rd party.

Windows/desktop don't update well [make the file system live -- this would be difficult to do under UNIX]

They update well for me.

They don't update well here (at least not all the time). For example, drag a URL or a text clipping from a browser window to the desktop and most of the time you don't see it appear on the desktop unless you switch to the Finder.

No, it updates instantly for me.

Command dragging a file to align it to a grid is a pain because command clicking a selected file deselects it on mouse down [the selection/deselection should happen on mouse-up]

S

I don't think this is subjective. I've also found it to be a pain in the butt. There should be different combinations of modifier keys for those actions.

I meant that the 'pain' is subjective. It's an issue at most, but it's not a pain to me since I always use "Arrange windows automatically".

The multi-user security crap is a pain in the ass -- I was setting up an app on a users computer and it wouldn't work for him but would work for me, turns out it was just a file permissions issue and didn't take too long to fix, but it's a pain [option to disable the multi-user state, and file permissions]

CM

I've gotten used to the multi-user setup of OS X, but permissions can certainly be a pain. I can certainly understand why it would be easier for many people to have a single-user system

So use it in single user mode? I really don't understand the problem. Create an
admin account, and have all your users use that account.

You have to keep typing in your password for crap all the time (like chaging the date, or installing an app) [allow single user mode with none of that crap]

CM

I don't see why this is close-minded. It is a pain in the butt to use many OS X installers compared to OS 9. I'm a little sick of having to type in my password.

It's a security measure even without the multi-user angle. Jus think how many spyware fluff that couldn't work in Windows if the user needed to supply a password before something installed. And passwords in OSX are only needed when you install something that want to put files in places admin generally don't have access to - and thus could seriously harm the system.

--
Sandman[.net]
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <240720030052439097%nadeama@mac.com>,
Martin Nadeau <nadeama@mac.com> wrote:

Also, the Dock's popup menus don't have to be "delayed". Just press
the Control key first and they'll appear immediately.

Or right click if you have a mutliple-button mouse.

It's a horrible design feature. You can have the same folder displayed in two windws, get confused at what you're looking and and cause damage because you think you have two copies of something.

It's a very useful design feature. But one has to know what one is
doing.

In what situation is this useful though? Not that I'm doubting what
you're saying, but I'm just curious as to what use it can have.

When the window is larger than the monitor screen, and you need to view
two different parts of it that can't fit into the one window on that
monitor, as an example.

As I said, I clicked on the button to turn off the window bar, and it stayed turned off.

I think he means that if you close the window and then open it again,
the toolbar will be back on.

OK, the tool bar inherits its state from the parent window if you
navigate to it. If you open it directly from the Go menu (or by a
command shortcut), it retains its setting.

--Michelle

--
Never play strip tarot.
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <6c1bcfe1.0307221839.25e54aa0@posting.google.com>,
OSX_is_1984@yahoo.com (George O) wrote:

Kevin_Stevens@hotmail.com wrote in message news:<20030722112802.U95732@babelfish.pursued-with.net>...

On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Revanant Morituri wrote:

And some people _don't_ need a multi user environment.

Anyone using a Unix machine needs a multi-user environment, because the system is designed to use "user" accounts to differentiate various system-level tasks. Bypassing this system architecture breaks an
important aspect of how it is designed to operate.

BZZZTT! *Wrong answer!* This is exactly the kind of inverted thinking
that is responsible for the organizational chaos of OS X. The *first*
thing you design is the interface --

BZZZTTT! Wrong answer!

Doing the above is *exactly* why the old MacOS sucked so bad. No
thought was given to the OS underneath the interface - and it showed!

Look, you are perfectly welcome to continue to use old MacOS. So are
all the other "old time Mac users". There are more than enough
intelligent, "new time Mac users" to make up the difference.

Jim
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <SmmdndnqgeqDyIKiXTWJjw@gbronline.com>,
Wesley Groleau <wesgroleau@myrealbox.com> wrote:

Alice Faber wrote:

resides, she created folders for each of her daughters, without creating separate log-on accounts for them. The idea of setting up separate accounts for them would, I think, strike her as over-kill and

nice they're so well-behaved. :-)

Indeed...

On OS 9, not even breaking their favorite games
several times taught my two boys to stop "experimenting"
with control panels and extensions.

I think that if the girls broke something, her solution would have been
to restrict their access to this computer. She would view it as overkill
to set up separate accounts, as it would mean that *she* would have to
login also when *she* wants to use the computer.

--
AF
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <timmcn-C2D1E1.17015224072003@gemini.visi.com>,
Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote:

Frankly, all my screens are crystal clear, and text in 9pt are
never, ever hard for me to read. I just have a hard time
understanding how people can have these problems unless they have
poor eyesight or a old monitor.

Most people probably don't have flat screen monitors- why in God's
name should you have to buy a new monitor just because you have OS X?

Um, first the complaint is that I don't see the effects because I have a
poor monitor; now the complaint is that you need a good monitor in order
to avoid them. I realize the complaints come from different people.

And many computer users are over 40- hence the problems with 9 pt
text, especially if it's aliased.

I am 60; wear bifocals with astigmatism correction, and my uncorrected
vision is worse than 20/400--they don't measure it past there.

Admittedly, with the 15" CRT iMac, I had to set the monitor for 800 by
600, but with this monitor, I have it set for 1440 by 900.

--
Never play strip tarot.
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <timmcn-C2D1E1.17015224072003@gemini.visi.com>,
Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote:

In article <mr-03B847.07534424072003@news.fu-berlin.de>,
Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:

Frankly, all my screens are crystal clear, and text in 9pt are never, ever hard for me to read. I just have a hard time understanding how people can have these problems unless they have poor eyesight or a old monitor.

Most people probably don't have flat screen monitors-

Neither do I actually. I don't even use fairly new monitors either - but I do have good vision.

why in God's name should you have to buy a new monitor just because you have OS X?

I think anyone with poor eyesight should get a GOOD monitor - not necessarily apples latest 23" cinema display. A nice 19" monitor is dirt cheap these days.

And many computer users are over 40- hence the problems with 9 pt text, especially if it's aliased.

My father is over 50 and hasn't got such problems (although, ironically, he does have the 22" cinema display).

--
Sandman[.net]
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <timmcn-C2D1E1.17015224072003@gemini.visi.com>,
Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote:

Most people probably don't have flat screen monitors- why in God's
name should you have to buy a new monitor just because you have OS X?
And many computer users are over 40- hence the problems with 9 pt
text, especially if it's aliased.

By default, Apple doesn't do anti-aliasing on 9 point text.

Except maybe in WebKit/Safari, where it seems to be stuck on
for everything permanently :-(


--
Matthew T. Russotto mrussotto@speakeasy.net "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
of justice is no virtue." But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
a modicum of security is a very expensive vice.
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <68a1v-egu2.ln1@pursued-with.net>,
Kevin Stevens <Kevin_Stevens@Hotmail.com> wrote:

I hated the Mac OS - it was
the most fascist OS I had to deal with on a daily basis. The very
notion of a computer I had to BEG to give me my floppy disk back was offensive (still is, for that matter).

Huh? You told the Mac that you were through using the floppy and it
handed it to you. That's fascist?

--
Hank Gillette
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113