From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Suddenly, my iBook G4 1.33 GHz (just out of warranty...) will not boot.
It stops at the grey apple before the little carousel appears, or even a
tad before, mostly not allowing me as far as a single-user boot so I can
see what happens.

It was running Tiger (10.4.6 w/latest updates) in 768 MB of RAM at the
time this happened, and we can see no clear change that happened just
before and that maight have a connection.

The funny thing is, the disk spins and works. In Target mode, I got all
the data off the disk, no sweat. I reinstalled Tiger on it via FW, doing
a clean install w/format, given the circumstances. Both that _and_
Migration Assistant ran without a hitch (MA both ways).

It is worth noting, though, that the iBook also would not boot from the
Tiger Install DVD, but that I had to connect to another Mac and run the Installer from there. However, that ran smoothly.

However, once having a new OS installed, the same symptoms: No boot,
only the disk spinning idly.

Is it poossible that a repartitioning (slight shrinking) might eliminate
bad (boot) blocks at the start of the default single partition, or is
the disk simply a goner and should be replaced? Or are there other
solutions compatible with the scenario, such as a bad disk controller or connection somewhere, or RAM gone bad (suddenly)?

I'm stumped, and ideas are welcome! :-)
TIA.
--
/Jon
For mail address, run the following in Terminal:
echo 36199371860304980107073482417748002696458P|dc
Skype: storhaugen
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <1he32xw.amps8m1og6589N%see_signature@mac.com.invalid>, see_signature@mac.com.invalid (Jon) writes:

Suddenly, my iBook G4 1.33 GHz (just out of warranty...) will not boot.
It stops at the grey apple before the little carousel appears, or even a
tad before, mostly not allowing me as far as a single-user boot so I can
see what happens.

It was running Tiger (10.4.6 w/latest updates) in 768 MB of RAM at the
time this happened, and we can see no clear change that happened just
before and that maight have a connection.

The funny thing is, the disk spins and works. In Target mode, I got all
the data off the disk, no sweat. I reinstalled Tiger on it via FW, doing
a clean install w/format, given the circumstances. Both that _and_
Migration Assistant ran without a hitch (MA both ways).

It is worth noting, though, that the iBook also would not boot from the
Tiger Install DVD, but that I had to connect to another Mac and run the >Installer from there. However, that ran smoothly.

However, once having a new OS installed, the same symptoms: No boot,
only the disk spinning idly.

Is it poossible that a repartitioning (slight shrinking) might eliminate
bad (boot) blocks at the start of the default single partition, or is
the disk simply a goner and should be replaced? Or are there other
solutions compatible with the scenario, such as a bad disk controller or >connection somewhere, or RAM gone bad (suddenly)?

It looks as if your PRAM is corrupted. Boot and press Alt-Opt-p-r until you hear the startup sound. Keep the four keys pressed until hear the startup sound a second and a third time. Then release the keys and see, whether your iBook will boot (might take a long time the first time afterwards).

Alternatively, when you press Alt-V during boot, do you see anything interesting?

Regards,
Christoph Gartmann

--
Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452
Immunbiologie
Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de
D-79011 Freiburg, Germany
http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Christoph Gartmann <gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de> wrote:

It looks as if your PRAM is corrupted. Boot and press Alt-Opt-p-r until
you hear the startup sound. Keep the four keys pressed until hear the
startup sound a second and a third time. Then release the keys and see, whether your iBook will boot (might take a long time the first time afterwards).

That seemed to help in that the iBook then gets past the grey apple, but
stops at the blue screen before the login window appears. I repeated,
but got the same result.

I tried taking all power from the computer for 30 minutes + resetting
P-ram for good measure, but got the same result.

Alternatively, when you press Alt-V during boot, do you see anything interesting?

The last item before stop seems to be pretty consistent:
"Login Window Applicaton started" *)

*) Please remember that this is a completely fresh system install and
that this happened both before and after that install, which makes it
hard to believe that two copies of the same app in different versions
(first the one from the 10.4.6 system and then the fresh 10.4.0 version)
should be shot in both cases.

After that it either stops, still in console mode, or goes on to the
blue screen and then stops.

I then tried to delete the loginwidow prefs by mounting the machine in
Target mode, but that had no effect.

I am running out of options here. And as you can gather, the FW Target
mode still works without a hitch. Strange!
--
/Jon
For mail address, run the following in Terminal:
echo 36199371860304980107073482417748002696458P|dc
Skype: storhaugen
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <1he3cju.8424ew9b5cayN%see_signature@mac.com.invalid>,
see_signature@mac.com.invalid (Jon) wrote:

Christoph Gartmann <gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de> wrote:

It looks as if your PRAM is corrupted. Boot and press Alt-Opt-p-r until
you hear the startup sound. Keep the four keys pressed until hear the startup sound a second and a third time. Then release the keys and see, whether your iBook will boot (might take a long time the first time afterwards).

That seemed to help in that the iBook then gets past the grey apple, but stops at the blue screen before the login window appears. I repeated,
but got the same result.

I tried taking all power from the computer for 30 minutes + resetting
P-ram for good measure, but got the same result.

Alternatively, when you press Alt-V during boot, do you see anything interesting?

The last item before stop seems to be pretty consistent:
"Login Window Applicaton started" *)

*) Please remember that this is a completely fresh system install and
that this happened both before and after that install, which makes it
hard to believe that two copies of the same app in different versions
(first the one from the 10.4.6 system and then the fresh 10.4.0 version) should be shot in both cases.

After that it either stops, still in console mode, or goes on to the
blue screen and then stops.

I then tried to delete the loginwidow prefs by mounting the machine in
Target mode, but that had no effect.

I am running out of options here. And as you can gather, the FW Target
mode still works without a hitch. Strange!

To eliminate hardware as an issue, start the _other_ machine in Target
Disk Mode, connect it to the failing iBook, and start the iBook while
holding the Option key down. Select the other machine's disk and
continue the startup.

If you get the same class of failure, you have a non-disk related
hardware failure.

If everything is normal, something is wrong with the installation or configuration on the iBook. Attach the iBook in TDM and examine its log
files for some clue.

--
Tom Stiller

PGP fingerprint = 5108 DDB2 9761 EDE5 E7E3
7BDA 71ED 6496 99C0 C7CF
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Jon <see_signature@mac.com.invalid> wrote:

Christoph Gartmann <gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de> wrote:

It looks as if your PRAM is corrupted. Boot and press Alt-Opt-p-r until
you hear the startup sound. Keep the four keys pressed until hear the startup sound a second and a third time. Then release the keys and see, whether your iBook will boot (might take a long time the first time afterwards).

That seemed to help in that the iBook then gets past the grey apple, but stops at the blue screen before the login window appears. I repeated,
but got the same result.

I tried taking all power from the computer for 30 minutes + resetting
P-ram for good measure, but got the same result.

Alternatively, when you press Alt-V during boot, do you see anything interesting?

The last item before stop seems to be pretty consistent:
"Login Window Applicaton started" *)

*) Please remember that this is a completely fresh system install and
that this happened both before and after that install, which makes it
hard to believe that two copies of the same app in different versions
(first the one from the 10.4.6 system and then the fresh 10.4.0 version) should be shot in both cases.

After that it either stops, still in console mode, or goes on to the
blue screen and then stops.

I then tried to delete the loginwidow prefs by mounting the machine in
Target mode, but that had no effect.

I am running out of options here. And as you can gather, the FW Target
mode still works without a hitch. Strange!

I have now even changed the disk and - again - reinstalled the system +
again zapped PRAM. No effect, it still stalls in the boot process.

I can also report that running the iBook in Target Disk mode, it will
happily work as a boot volume for another Mac, so it seems more and more
likely that it is _not_ the disk that is the problem, but some other
component. The question, of course, is _what_ component, and can it be
changed by me?

Booting in Verbose mode, I still get to around "Login Window Application starting", then everything stops - if not a little before. And it is
still impossible to boot from the internal DVD drive as well.

Ideas? I am stumped...
--
/Jon
For mail address, run the following in Terminal:
echo 36199371860304980107073482417748002696458P|dc
Skype: storhaugen
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

Tom Stiller <tomstiller@comcast.net> wrote:

To eliminate hardware as an issue, start the _other_ machine in Target
Disk Mode, connect it to the failing iBook, and start the iBook while
holding the Option key down. Select the other machine's disk and
continue the startup.

Will do - in fact, have done. Doesn't work, because I don't get far
enough to select the other startup disk.

If you get the same class of failure, you have a non-disk related
hardware failure.

That is what I am thinking now.

If everything is normal, something is wrong with the installation or configuration on the iBook. Attach the iBook in TDM and examine its log files for some clue.

I'll do that. Thanks.
--
/Jon
For mail address, run the following in Terminal:
echo 36199371860304980107073482417748002696458P|dc
Skype: storhaugen
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <1he3r09.18y45j51ftgj0gN%see_signature@mac.com.invalid>,
see_signature@mac.com.invalid (Jon) wrote:

Tom Stiller <tomstiller@comcast.net> wrote:

To eliminate hardware as an issue, start the _other_ machine in Target
Disk Mode, connect it to the failing iBook, and start the iBook while holding the Option key down. Select the other machine's disk and
continue the startup.

Will do - in fact, have done. Doesn't work, because I don't get far
enough to select the other startup disk.

If you get the same class of failure, you have a non-disk related
hardware failure.

That is what I am thinking now.

If everything is normal, something is wrong with the installation or configuration on the iBook. Attach the iBook in TDM and examine its log files for some clue.

I'll do that. Thanks.

You might also try starting the iBook in OpenFirmware mode by holding Command-Option-O-F. If you get as far as a prompt, type
reset-nvram (return)
reset-all (return)

The iBook should restart and maybe even boot. :-)

Good luck.

--
Tom Stiller

PGP fingerprint = 5108 DDB2 9761 EDE5 E7E3
7BDA 71ED 6496 99C0 C7CF
--- Synchronet 3.18b-Win32 NewsLink 1.113

From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.system

In article <1he32xw.amps8m1og6589N%see_signature@mac.com.invalid>, Jon <see_signature@mac.com.invalid> wrote:

Suddenly, my iBook G4 1.33 GHz (just out of warranty...) will not boot.
It stops at the grey apple before the little carousel appears, or even a
tad before, mostly not allowing me as far as a single-user boot so I can
see what happens.

Do you have anything plugged into the USB or Firewire when this occurs?
If so, and you remove it, does it boot?

I ask because I had a USB hub that would totally hang my iMac, just as
you describe your iBook doing. Just a thought.

--
Garner R. Miller
Clifton Park, NY =USA=
http://www.garnermiller.com/
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